04 WR450 fork oil level and volume question


20 replies to this topic
  • miknewman

Posted January 20, 2006 - 10:40 AM

#1

I ride my WR450 at the track and wanted to add fork oil in 5mm increments as the manual states in order to stiffen the forks slightly. Assuming the dealer added the correct and same fork oil level to each fork, Does anyone know how much volume that 5mm of fork oil equates to on this fork. Additionally, I was going to add oil with a syringe and needle thru the air bleed screw, any comments on pitfalls of doing that.

  • charliep

Posted January 20, 2006 - 05:11 PM

#2

I have an 05 and would like to know about adding fork oil the easiest way possible?

  • ncmountainman

Posted January 20, 2006 - 09:11 PM

#3

its probly about time to change the fluid anyhow,measure where its at now with the spring removed and add another 10 mm extra when you replace it,if thats not enough it can be added as you suggested with a syringe but its slow going and always doesn't take it well. if your patient its possible :thumbsup:

  • miknewman

Posted January 21, 2006 - 11:00 AM

#4

My 04 WR450 is brand new and only been ridden once so an oil change isn't called for yet. Any ideas about how much volume 5mm is?

  • ncmountainman

Posted January 21, 2006 - 01:24 PM

#5

My 04 WR450 is brand new and only been ridden once so an oil change isn't called for yet. Any ideas about how much volume 5mm is?

well the crap they put in there from the factory isn't worthy. it was called for before you rode it! its not that hard to remove the forks and get it over with. when i've done it that way i used 10cc's at a time(not quite sure how much it was raising it but the difference was noticeable) :thumbsup:

  • Dan_Lorenze

Posted January 23, 2006 - 08:52 AM

#6

My 04 WR450 is brand new and only been ridden once so an oil change isn't called for yet. Any ideas about how much volume 5mm is?


Mike, no I don't know the exact volume in CC's that equal 5mm but I think that NC's advise is good. 10cc's at a time is a good measurement. The whole problem here is you want to add some fork oil but don't want disassemble the forks to measure the level the proper way, I with ya... I don't know if I would go through the trouble to make a small adjustment either. Go ahead and add 5 to 10cc's at a time but the only problem is you really don't know what level you're at when you're finished.

  • WGP

Posted January 23, 2006 - 09:11 AM

#7

I just took my forks to the dealer for an oil change. 280$ with new seals.
Its 05 WR450
I did it after 1800 miles of Desert Riding, you guys recommend doing it yourself? I was scared to screw up my forks, by getting dirt inside or something stupid.
Aren't the proper tools expensive? And do you really need to replace the seals everytime you change the oil?

  • Dan_Lorenze

Posted January 23, 2006 - 09:39 AM

#8

I just took my forks to the dealer for an oil change. 280$ with new seals.
Its 05 WR450
I did it after 1800 miles of Desert Riding, you guys recommend doing it yourself? I was scared to screw up my forks, by getting dirt inside or something stupid.
Aren't the proper tools expensive? And do you really need to replace the seals everytime you change the oil?


WGP, I just finished my first fork service. I too have an 05 with a lot of miles on it. I finally blew a fork seal out. I believe Sealsavers did their job. But it was time to replace the seals. I had a friend of mine show me how to do it. I couldn't believe how bad my fork fluid looked. It looked like dirty green slime. The only tool I bought was a fork seal driver, I bought the Motion Pro 48mm seal driver for $50.00 Some say you don't need a driver to install the seals but I wanted the right tool for the job. Seals and wipers were $33.00 total and I purchased a bottle of "Enzo Kayaba" fork fluid for $11.00 but you need two bottles to get your oil level to 5" or 128mm. My fluid level is at 5".

Total cost for everything was $105.00 But the next time I do it the cost would be $66.00 for seals,wipers and only one bottle of fluid. I now own the driver.

Other tools you'll need are a thin 17mm open ended wrench to take the fork cap off the internal rod and some electrical tape to protect the seal and wiper when installing over the bushing groove so that the seal/wiper doesn't get cut.

I went out riding on Saturday and couldn't believe the difference that fresh fork oil makes. Amazing.....

I strongly recommend doing this yourself, you save a lot of money and you'll feel proud that you did it yourself...

Dan :thumbsup:

  • Dan_Lorenze

Posted January 23, 2006 - 09:46 AM

#9

I just took my forks to the dealer for an oil change. 280$ with new seals.


That's robbery......... It should take a qualified mechanic ONE hour to do everything. Dealer cost on bulk oil, seals and wipers are cheap.... Even if you were to bring the bike in it would still be out of line. IMO

  • Punisher 660

Posted January 23, 2006 - 10:00 AM

#10

My 04 WR450 is brand new and only been ridden once so an oil change isn't called for yet. Any ideas about how much volume 5mm is?


Check the web, there are plenty of conversion calculators out there.

Visit the ThumperTalk Store for the lowest prices on motorcycle / ATV parts and accessories - Guaranteed
  • MichielD

Posted January 23, 2006 - 10:34 AM

#11

I ride my WR450 at the track and wanted to add fork oil in 5mm increments as the manual states in order to stiffen the forks slightly. Assuming the dealer added the correct and same fork oil level to each fork, Does anyone know how much volume that 5mm of fork oil equates to on this fork. Additionally, I was going to add oil with a syringe and needle thru the air bleed screw, any comments on pitfalls of doing that.


V=Pi (r*r) H
Your forks are cylinders with a dia of 48mm or 4.8cm so r= 2.4
H is 5mm or .5cm
pi=3.14

v= 3.14 (2.4 *2.4) 0.5
= 9.05 cm3 0r ~ 9cc's

However, there are other parts in there, such as the plastic spring guide,that displaces extra volume, that I can't calculate.

  • MichielD

Posted January 23, 2006 - 10:45 AM

#12

Oh, by the way I made my own seal driver.
- Measure the outside diameter of the thinner fork tube.
- go to the hard ware store and buy a piece of ABS pipe with approx the same inside diameter as the outside that you measured.
- buy two hose clamps that can fit around this pipe.
- cut the pipe into two pieces about 4" long.
- slice these pieces down the middle so you have two halves that look like this ( ).
- assemble forks according to your manual.
- place two halves on the fork and secure with the clamp tightly.
- place the other two halves above those and secure lightly with a clamp.
- now use one to drive the other, pushingb the seal in.
- If this sounds complex , look at the pics in the manual of the "seal driver" in action, it will all become clear than.

It takes me about an hour to an hour and a half to remove both forks, waste the old flud , clean them up, replace fluid and bleed, and put them back on. And I have only done them twice.

  • WGP

Posted January 23, 2006 - 11:00 AM

#13

That's robbery......... It should take a qualified mechanic ONE hour to do everything. Dealer cost on bulk oil, seals and wipers are cheap.... Even if you were to bring the bike in it would still be out of line. IMO


Ya, Thats what I thought I took my forks off myself and handed them just the forks. They said 1.5 hours labor per fork :thumbsup:

What about a soft clamp for the vice? How did you hold them ?

What are those dealers good for besides taking your money. Good thing I didn't need a rebuild :bonk:

  • Dan_Lorenze

Posted January 23, 2006 - 11:28 AM

#14

Ya, Thats what I thought I took my forks off myself and handed them just the forks. They said 1.5 hours labor per fork :thumbsup:

What about a soft clamp for the vice? How did you hold them ?

What are those dealers good for besides taking your money. Good thing I didn't need a rebuild :bonk:



Service departments set standards for time on jobs. Honestly, I can't see it taking that long..

No need to put the fork into any type of vise. The trick is to loosen the fork caps while the forks are still on the bike. I layed the forks on my workbench and did all the work while they were laying down. I propped them up on end to fill them with the oil.

Man, I want to think that "Bones" at Pro Circuit would have serviced and re-valved your forks for less then 300 bucks. No problem, just a good lesson for all of us....

http://procircuit.ri.../suspension.php

  • Ibis

Posted January 23, 2006 - 04:42 PM

#15

My 04 WR450 is brand new and only been ridden once so an oil change isn't called for yet. Any ideas about how much volume 5mm is?


You have a 46mm fork and assuming the inside diameter of the upper fork leg is ~50mm - using the Pi r² routine, 5mm = 10cc

On the subject of suspension oil changes, I have Dick's Racing susp on my KTM450 and Precision Concepts on my XR650. Both of these tuners recommend oil changes after 35 to 40 hrs of use. I do believe this is an area where most of us off road guys neglect an important maintenance item.

  • SJMC_DON

Posted January 23, 2006 - 05:54 PM

#16

I have an 04' and it has been too soft from day one for the MX Track. Your manual will give the allowable range with out the spring in it, I took mine to the highest level allowable on the range, I believe it's 3.15 inches from the top of the fork tube.

I just recently went with a heavier spring and lighter oil, it's working out real good :thumbsup:

  • SJMC_DON

Posted January 23, 2006 - 05:56 PM

#17

Oh, by the way I made my own seal driver.
- Measure the outside diameter of the thinner fork tube.
- go to the hard ware store and buy a piece of ABS pipe with approx the same inside diameter as the outside that you measured.
- buy two hose clamps that can fit around this pipe.
- cut the pipe into two pieces about 4" long.
- slice these pieces down the middle so you have two halves that look like this ( ).
- assemble forks according to your manual.
- place two halves on the fork and secure with the clamp tightly.
- place the other two halves above those and secure lightly with a clamp.
- now use one to drive the other, pushingb the seal in.
- If this sounds complex , look at the pics in the manual of the "seal driver" in action, it will all become clear than.

It takes me about an hour to an hour and a half to remove both forks, waste the old flud , clean them up, replace fluid and bleed, and put them back on. And I have only done them twice.


Yep, I love my $1.38 seal driver :thumbsup: my friend showed me that and I think it is one of the best little secrets out there. Forks are easy :bonk:

  • Dan_Lorenze

Posted January 23, 2006 - 06:53 PM

#18

Both of these tuners recommend oil changes after 35 to 40 hrs of use. I do believe this is an area where most of us off road guys neglect an important maintenance item.


Ibis, I agree... And as Don said, it's just too easy not to do it..

  • miknewman

Posted January 25, 2006 - 09:13 AM

#19

Thanks for all the input. I didn't quite get the answer that I was looking for so I call my local Yamaha shop and talked with the service guy. A little plug for Vickery here in Denver as they are always very helpful when I call with questions. The guy in service said that 5mm equals roughly 5cc which would seem to make sense since using the math formula comes up with 9cc without any innards.

  • ncmountainman

Posted January 25, 2006 - 09:18 AM

#20

cool,1cc per mm. very good to know :thumbsup:




 
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