XR650L - What was it designed for?


44 replies to this topic
  • BWB63

Posted September 02, 2005 - 02:38 PM

#21

OK, sounds like the XRL challenge is on!

As long as its not a speed or jumping contest, lets hear what an XR400 or XR650R will do that the XRL won't.

I love a challenge...


Dave


On a XR400 I can climb anything a XL650L can. I can ride longer and faster on tight single track. I can pull a wheelie in third and shift into 4th and 5th. (My XR400 has a stock bore but, it does not have stock carburetor or exhaust). To bad the challenge can't be completed because of distance, I would love to take this challenge. Sure if you change the rules enough and take out big hills also, a CRF230 can be in the mix (also NOT a serious off road bike). To bad someone didn't say DRZ400e. It can do everything a XL650L can and more!

XR650R is no contest because it is a serious off road bike. Not as serious as a KTM525 but, It can do a few things better then that bike and a lot not as good.
The rider might be a serious off road rider but, The XL650L is NOT. You might make it anywhere, any other bike can but, if you push a CRF50 (or carry it) it too will. The silly part about this talk is "a guy buys a bike and it's 'HIS' and he is proud of it" if you get into what it can and can't do compared to another bike, most get all bent out of shape. They haven't even spent years on other bikes, all they know is they have a bike that works and they are having a blast! Great but, what has that to do with comparing bikes?

If a XR650R can get there faster with less effort, it is better. If a XR400 can get there faster with less effort it is better. I have been on tight single track (with a XR400) that I can get through faster and with less effort then my XR650R. In that case (or on that trail) the XR400 is better. In the dirt in all ways, at all times the XR650R is better then the XR650L. The suspension on the XR650L is a joke. The carburetor is a joke. The weight is a joke, all can be fixed to a point but, that takes money. The XR650R has the suspension the XR650L needs but, would need lighter fluid to be ideal. The carburetor on the XR650R would be OK on the XL650L, there are a lot of things that can be done to loose some of the weight on the XL650L. This same story is gone through time and again between XR650R bikes, Stock carburetor, stock suspension, stock exhaust. There are those that these stock parts are "Good enough" but, there are bike that are much better with after market setups. If your riding off road I don't see the need for the "L", they cost about the same. I can get a New, XR650R (2004) OTD for $4,999.

My GMC Safari or Chevy Astro van can go almost every where that my lifted Chevy truck can but, it's not an off road vehicle. Just because someone likes to put around off road and go anywhere on there XL650L doesn't make it an equal to other off road bikes because, the rider is good enough to make the bike get there.

The XR650L was made at low cost for a certain "type of person". It's what a lot of guy's call a "Parts Bike". The bike is not made for a certain type of rider but, is targeted for a certain type of buyer. It's not about "YOUR" bike or how well "YOU" can ride it. But, what the bike can do (all things being the same) against other bikes.

It would have been better if you could have come up with anything that the XR650"L" can do the same as "GOOD" as the XR650R or XR400 off road.....nothing :D
But, Jayzonk got it right it can do these thing good,

It's good for going from A to B by the least direct route.
It's good for going on secondary highways and backroads, then finding a spot in a small town to kick your boots off, have a drink and eat a sandwich at a local diner.
It's good for going and closing the gate after all the cows are in the pasture.
It's good for following your kid when he's on his first motorbike so he feels secure, and so his dad feels like his buddy too.
It's good for guys that need to get out of the house and blow off some stress by hitting a trail.



  • Jeephoto

Posted September 02, 2005 - 07:25 PM

#22

Maybe Mother Honda didn't design the XRL to compete with the XRR?

Maybe there are different kinds of Honda riders: fast riders, some who like to jump, some who like high-speed trail or desert riding, some who want a dependable go-anywhere bike to explore the world at a more leisurely pace.

Next year, I turn the birthday clock over to 50. Twenty five years ago, I WAS the jumper, the mudder, the hill climber and the trail racer. Today, I just want to explore what lies beyond the hill or around that next turn: pavement, gravel, dirt, Jeep trails, mountain passes, country roads, forestry roads. Wherever that road takes me.

My oldest son is 18 and rides his CRF230F just like it was a CR250! Ripping it, quick shifting, wheelies, jumps, the more mud-the better. There is just not enough power or suspension on that little bike to satisfy him. Interestingly, that is EXACTLY the kind of rider I was at that age; he mirrors me perfectly. Maybe the XRR would be a good bike for him, just hang enough lights on it to legally connect the trails.

If the XRL will get me wherever I want to go and put a smile on my face while I'm doing it, it would seem the XRL IS doing what Honda designed it to do. :D

  • roadcam

Posted September 03, 2005 - 08:12 AM

#23

Maybe Mother Honda didn't design the XRL to compete with the XRR?

Maybe there are different kinds of Honda riders: fast riders, some who like to jump, some who like high-speed trail or desert riding, some who want a dependable go-anywhere bike to explore the world at a more leisurely pace.

Next year, I turn the birthday clock over to 50. Twenty five years ago, I WAS the jumper, the mudder, the hill climber and the trail racer. Today, I just want to explore what lies beyond the hill or around that next turn: pavement, gravel, dirt, Jeep trails, mountain passes, country roads, forestry roads. Wherever that road takes me.

My oldest son is 18 and rides his CRF230F just like it was a CR250! Ripping it, quick shifting, wheelies, jumps, the more mud-the better. There is just not enough power or suspension on that little bike to satisfy him. Interestingly, that is EXACTLY the kind of rider I was at that age; he mirrors me perfectly. Maybe the XRR would be a good bike for him, just hang enough lights on it to legally connect the trails.

If the XRL will get me wherever I want to go and put a smile on my face while I'm doing it, it would seem the XRL IS doing what Honda designed it to do. :D



I couldn't agree more ... :D

  • Dual_Dog

Posted September 03, 2005 - 09:25 AM

#24

Maybe Mother Honda didn't design the XRL to compete with the XRR?

Well said.

Maybe there are different kinds of Honda riders: fast riders, some who like to jump, some who like high-speed trail or desert riding, some who want a dependable go-anywhere bike to explore the world at a more leisurely pace.

Different bikes for different types of riding and for different types or riders who "might" be at a different stage with regards to their level of expectation and their riding experience.

Next year, I turn the birthday clock over to 50. Twenty five years ago, I WAS the jumper, the mudder, the hill climber and the trail racer. Today, I just want to explore what lies beyond the hill or around that next turn: pavement, gravel, dirt, Jeep trails, mountain passes, country roads, forestry roads. Wherever that road takes me.

There aren't very many places this bike can't go.

My oldest son is 18 and rides his CRF230F just like it was a CR250! Ripping it, quick shifting, wheelies, jumps, the more mud-the better. There is just not enough power or suspension on that little bike to satisfy him. Interestingly, that is EXACTLY the kind of rider I was at that age; he mirrors me perfectly. Maybe the XRR would be a good bike for him, just hang enough lights on it to legally connect the trails.

With the XRL (or other DS bike) you'll be able to introduce your son to a new type of off-road riding and exploration.

If the XRL will get me wherever I want to go and put a smile on my face while I'm doing it, it would seem the XRL IS doing what Honda designed it to do. :D

Damn straight. And it'll get you back as well. Good luck with your decision, even though it sounds like you might've already made up your mind. And about the mods? They can also be a (big) part of the ownership experience. It can turn out to be much more than just a hobby. It has for me... :D

  • BWB63

Posted September 03, 2005 - 09:35 AM

#25

Maybe Mother Honda didn't design the XRL to compete with the XRR?

Maybe there are different kinds of Honda riders: fast riders, some who like to jump, some who like high-speed trail or desert riding, some who want a dependable go-anywhere bike to explore the world at a more leisurely pace.

Next year, I turn the birthday clock over to 50. Twenty five years ago, I WAS the jumper, the mudder, the hill climber and the trail racer. Today, I just want to explore what lies beyond the hill or around that next turn: pavement, gravel, dirt, Jeep trails, mountain passes, country roads, forestry roads. Wherever that road takes me.

My oldest son is 18 and rides his CRF230F just like it was a CR250! Ripping it, quick shifting, wheelies, jumps, the more mud-the better. There is just not enough power or suspension on that little bike to satisfy him. Interestingly, that is EXACTLY the kind of rider I was at that age; he mirrors me perfectly. Maybe the XRR would be a good bike for him, just hang enough lights on it to legally connect the trails.

If the XRL will get me wherever I want to go and put a smile on my face while I'm doing it, it would seem the XRL IS doing what Honda designed it to do. :D


That is the point exactly. They are worlds apart, like the CRF250R and the CRF230 are nothing a like and the CRF230 can do nothing as well as the CRF250R can....nothing.

  • FOUR STOKED

Posted September 03, 2005 - 02:21 PM

#26

Originally posted by BWB63
They are worlds apart, like the CRF250R and the CRF230 are nothing a like and the CRF230 can do nothing as well as the CRF250R can....nothing.


You are right. That includes eating valves and busting cylinder walls, although Honda did fix the cylinder problem after the 2004 model year. :D
These bikes have different duty cycles on the parts and are designed for different uses. The 230 is and engine based on a design that goes back well over 20 years and many from that era are still running. I doubt that the CRF 250 will have that kind of endurance. :D

  • BWB63

Posted September 03, 2005 - 03:22 PM

#27

You are right. That includes eating valves and busting cylinder walls, although Honda did fix the cylinder problem after the 2004 model year. :D
These bikes have different duty cycles on the parts and are designed for different uses. The 230 is and engine based on a design that goes back well over 20 years and many from that era are still running. I doubt that the CRF 250 will have that kind of endurance. :D



I think your signiture has a phrase that says a lot about the difference between those that buy XR650R's and those that buy bikes to curse fire roads with.

"Those who dance must appear quite insane to those who do not understand"

I think that is why this never goes away. People want to compare the bikes, and talk about the difference but, they don't want to here there bikes can't do the same things. The CRF250 has problems, as does the XR650R, KTM525 but, these are bikes that can do something. That doesn't make the CRF230 or XL650L worthless, just worth less if you want to do it all, in the dirt. There is a major limit to what you can do in the dirt with a CRF230 or XL650L. That is the point. They are two totaly different bikes. That doesn't make the rider of the "L" less happy. He bought the bike because he didn't want or need to do it all. But, there is nothing to compare.

  • huntmaster

Posted September 03, 2005 - 04:18 PM

#28

As long as its not a speed or jumping contest, lets hear what an XR400 or XR650R will do that the XRL won't.

???? Pretty much the point I think?
Kind of like saying, "except for performance and dogfighting ability I don't see what an F22 Raptor will do that an old F4 Phantom won't!
I guess they both do the same thing! :D

  • XR650L_Dave

Posted September 03, 2005 - 06:12 PM

#29

So I guess fastest possible speed and air-time is the only thing you can do that's serious on a dirt bike?

Compensating?

D

  • BWB63

Posted September 03, 2005 - 09:09 PM

#30

So I guess fastest possible speed and air-time is the only thing you can do that's serious on a dirt bike?

Compensating?

D


No, like usual you take it personal and you don't look that it said, "dirt". Better means better. If the XR650R can do dirt better it's the better bike. Like I said, a CRF230 can do just about anything if it has a rider willing to make it get there but, that doesn't make it on par with a XR650L, wait maybe in your book it does. CRF230, has the "E" button, air cooled, slow, suspension realy sucks............ya, I get it..........a bike that performs a certain job better then another doesn't mean better :D

I think that there are those that ride for different reasons and get different enjoyment riding at different levels but, that doesn't make their bike better or not. I am starting to see that most of the XL650L guys have there manhood attached to their bike.

Geez, if you can push the limits and ride well, I quess some take that as someone trying to compensating for something.........Maybe I am but, I am good at it :D


I like the XR650R for what I am doing right now but, it's not the best bike for everything I do. I can ride KTM525, CR250, CR500 or CRF450, XR400 what ever gets the job done. I ride with some top, young riders and on the trail sometimes I can ride faster, on the track with any bike they are faster then I ever was but, at the end of the day I am glad I was throwing dirt! Doesn't change my manhood if they say I have an old mans bike(XR650R) or not. I know on the MX track there CR250 is far superiour to my bike. Doesn't bother me. I setup their suspensions and they crack jokes, then I roost them :D

Well time to go to bed. I get up early to go Hunting....more compensating to do :eek:

???? Pretty much the point I think?
Kind of like saying, "except for performance and dogfighting ability I don't see what an F22 Raptor will do that an old F4 Phantom won't!
I guess they both do the same thing!

That makes the point real well!

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  • XR650L_Dave

Posted September 04, 2005 - 06:00 AM

#31

Well, I'm willing to say (and put money down) that my relatively unmodded XRL is BETTER than an XR400 or an XR650R at a trackless tight-woods steep uphill.

And BW et al, the only thing I take exception to is when someone says that the kind of riding I do isn't serious. If you folks want to take the attitude that not going hell-bent-for leather isn't manly or some such, I don't care. But if you say its not serious riding, you need correcting.

I guess that I should take the attitude reccommended by the church of the best-motorcycle-in-the-world, and forgive them, because they do not know better.

Or should I take a page from the All Terrain Assault Vehicle Army and just run your butts over while you're trying to kick-start?

Good terrain assaultin' to ya.

D

  • huntmaster

Posted September 04, 2005 - 06:22 AM

#32

????? I think the point was that they don't compete with each other. Performance is either important to you or not. That's why they make different models. Yet people keep trying to debate a non-issue! If you are unclear as to which bike here suits your needs here you are also unclear as to your riding preferences and habits.

So I guess fastest possible speed and air-time is the only thing you can do that's serious on a dirt bike? Compensating?



  • Dual_Dog

Posted September 04, 2005 - 06:27 AM

#33

One phrase comes up quite frequently, that the XRL is "perfect for what it was designed for".

What, in your opinion, does that mean?

One word comes to mind that really hasn't been said in this thread is FUN. 'Nough said...

  • Jayzonk

Posted September 04, 2005 - 07:03 AM

#34

An interesting read is the "Treatise on Lightweight Unsupported Motorcycle Touring," written by the CEO of Aerostich. You get a copy of it when you buy an Aerostich product. But it might be at www.aerostich.com as well. Seems to fit into the 650L's niche. In fact the author says that he did some motorcycle touring on a 650L, which he considers a perfect bike for the task.

  • BWB63

Posted September 04, 2005 - 10:00 AM

#35

Well, I'm willing to say (and put money down) that my relatively unmodded XRL is BETTER than an XR400 or an XR650R at a trackless tight-woods steep uphill.

And BW et al, the only thing I take exception to is when someone says that the kind of riding I do isn't serious. If you folks want to take the attitude that not going hell-bent-for leather isn't manly or some such, I don't care. But if you say its not serious riding, you need correcting.

I guess that I should take the attitude reccommended by the church of the best-motorcycle-in-the-world, and forgive them, because they do not know better.

Or should I take a page from the All Terrain Assault Vehicle Army and just run your butts over while you're trying to kick-start?

Good terrain assaultin' to ya.

D


Didn't say you where not serious or that you don't ride serious but, the XR650L is not a serious off road bike. The XR650L can not climb the steap up hills we have here. It's a whole different world. We climb mountains not hills. It's not the same as what you have and the XR650L's can not make it. The XR650R's can't make it but with the top riders. We had 18 riders on one hill and only a CRF450 made it. It is so crazy that you take it personal that the XR650L is not a dirt bike but, a duel sport bike that can be ridden off rode and if you have a good enough rider he can make it do things that it wasn't made to do. I guess that is why there are some broken frames.

How much money are you putting down??? You are going to out perform a XR650R on a XL650L?? On a hill climb? You are crazy...... :D

Can you PLease shut us up and show us some video of this monster hill climbs the XR650L can do???

http://www.borynack..../Jawbone/YT.wmv

http://www.borynack....deo/BWBsfhc.wmv

http://www.borynack....50r/jawbone.htm

  • XR650L_Dave

Posted September 04, 2005 - 04:36 PM

#36

Ummm, yeah, its a serious offroad bike (that's the part you refuse to believe, so I'll stop wasting heartbeats on it- by my scorekeeping, you've wasted a lot more of those on this than me) and it'll climb pretty damn good. The XR600R was a serious bike, and the L is a bit heavier, but its a good bit more XR600R than L.

I guess you missed the "trackless tight-woods" part. No question an open hill will favor the 'R', but that equation can change here in the northeast. No XR650Rs at thomaston dam, or at the meriden motorcycle club, or at the deposit trail-trials event that I remember (yeah, that's right, trials riding on an XR650L. Are trials bikes serious dirt bikes?). Northeast riding is a bit different than elsewhere.

The additional power of the R would do squat for ya, most places around here.

Sad thing about mostly riding alone is there's precious little chance for videos- those that have seen me ride, though, (not amateurs, but some fairly experienced enduro guys) were pretty well impressed with how 'serious' the L was in the tight woods.

Why do I persist? I have this weakness where I just feel the need to correct bone-headedness. Ah well, even I fail- sometimes.

Good hillclimbin' to ya.

Dave

  • Xr650LMartin

Posted September 04, 2005 - 05:14 PM

#37

Here's where I ride my L.. some of that is serious off-road..

http://www.thumperta...ad.php?t=288370

  • BrettJ

Posted September 04, 2005 - 07:43 PM

#38

"Why do I persist? I have this weakness where I just feel the need to correct bone-headedness. Ah well, even I fail- sometimes." ---Um that is the stupidest thing I have ever heard how can you call BWB63 a bone head. You are a fool, there is no point in me even trying to counter argue that a xr650l can do tight trails better than an xr400 or 650r that is such a stupid thing to say and it only shows your ignorance. If you look at the advice BWB63 has given in his posts it proves he isn't a bonehead and proves you are! :D

  • XR650L_Dave

Posted September 05, 2005 - 03:29 PM

#39

There is a difference between saying someone is doing something bone-headed, and saying they ARE a bonehead.

If I ever move to open country, or by some bizarre happanstance come across a street-legal R here in NY, BW is the first guy I'd talk to mods about.

Brett, you show off your ignorance like floozy who doesn't know her diamond is a cheap chunk of paste.

Did you see the part where I was talking about steep wooded uphill with no trail? The infinite tractability and dead-flat torque curve of the L would give it an advantage.

I think that as someone who actually rides an L, I can say what its capabilities are.
Next time, put down the photo of your R, put your other hand flat on the table, and read the whole freakin' post.

I didn't call BW a bonehead, but I am calling you one.

Neener, neener! (jees, lighten up)

D

  • theSWAN

Posted September 05, 2005 - 08:51 PM

#40

grow some fu(kin balls dave why did you mod your L whats the point you could just sheer a suzuki swift in half and probably get the same handeling with a bit more acceleration and top end get a clue mate and a radiator while your at it





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