Crf 600 X?


24 replies to this topic
  • Thumpmeister

Posted August 25, 2005 - 01:44 PM

#1

I've heard rumors flying around about this bike. The thing I'm wondering, is this actually a bike that is supposed to be coming out, or just that; a rumor? If the bike IS coming out, does anyone know where I can catch a glimpse of one?

  • BWB63

Posted August 25, 2005 - 02:01 PM

#2

Not even quite a rumor. More like a stir stick. :D

  • huntmaster

Posted August 25, 2005 - 02:08 PM

#3

The thing I'm wondering, is this actually a bike that is supposed to be coming out, or just that; a rumor?



maybe and yes.

  • iestrada

Posted August 25, 2005 - 02:44 PM

#4

Come on Irondude, tell us more!!! a pic will be nice

Originally Posted by irondude
Honda will start racing the new CRF600 in Baja within a year.
The first prototypes are now being tweaked in japan. Sorry-cant reveal sources...

Target is:
262 lbs
61 hp
ebutton
$7600


it will come in a motard version as well as dirt. The motard can be converted to dual sport with some new tires.



  • Naru

Posted August 25, 2005 - 03:17 PM

#5

I personally find it a bit hard to believe that Honda would make the bike, but a few on the forum swear it is coming and there's no reason not to believe them. Probably the best feature of the BRP is that it's bulletproof; if they take that away and update the bike with Ti valves and the like, they just have an overgrown motocross bike. This puts in a similar position as the KX500, and see where that went. Too big for serious woods competition or motocross, and too unreliable to travel around baja on for long distances. Sure it may be good for racing, but a good portion of the BRP's Honda sells just get used as longer distance, reliable dirt rigs.

Then again, Honda took the XR600 and upped the performance while still retaining an amazing degree of reliability. That may be their goal again, and if it is, 1. More power to them, and 2. I promise not to spend the money I'm going to use as a deposit for one down in a TJ strip bar.

  • Naru

Posted August 25, 2005 - 03:21 PM

#6

it will come in a motard version as well as dirt. The motard can be converted to dual sport with some new tires.


Don't forget that it will also require (1) miracle and (1) friend at the DMV if street registration is desired in Kaliforniastan.

  • don87xr600

Posted August 25, 2005 - 03:26 PM

#7

Don't forget that it will also require (1) miracle and (1) friend at the DMV if street registration is desired in Kaliforniastan.

Not if the motard version is street legal.

  • qadsan

Posted August 25, 2005 - 03:33 PM

#8

I've seen Team Honda practicing at different locations from time to time and on two of these several occasions earlier this year when I've seen them practicing they've been quick to either put a bike or two back in their box van or make them less obvious next to their accompanying motor home. As much as I'd like to stop in to visit them more often (and by the way they’re super nice guys), I know they are their to do a job and being interrupted is no fun, so I've kept my distances for the most part out of respect when I do see them, but sump'tin iz go-wen on :D

There were plenty of rumors flying about before the CRF450 debuted and then it finally appeared, but there are no guarantees about this bike until Honda makes a formal announcement and that won’t be coming for at least another year if ever and Honda will deny this bike exists until that time. There is more to this story and that all I will say, but keep your eyes and ears open and enjoy the ride :D

  • Naru

Posted August 25, 2005 - 04:12 PM

#9

Honda would be taking a huge step foreward if they simply used the XR650R platform for next year's XR650L, let alone a whole new bike.

Not if the motard version is street legal.



  • huntmaster

Posted August 25, 2005 - 06:53 PM

#10

There's no reason to think they would go that way...ti valves, no oil capacity, one piston ring, etc. There's no replacement for displacement and with a 600 you don't have to spin a gazillion revs to make power. It would not be based on some MX design (a good thing for longevity) like all the 450's as there is no racing class or market there...at least in North America.

Peak power wouldn't even need to be much higher, but as with the 650, torque would be a huge advantage. Add the obligatory happy button, knock off a few pounds and it could be an awesome bike. That's why I'm sure they won't build it! 5 or more years without selling a customer major engine parts? We can't have that!


I personally find it a bit hard to believe that Honda would make the bike, but a few on the forum swear it is coming and there's no reason not to believe them. Probably the best feature of the BRP is that it's bulletproof; if they take that away and update the bike with Ti valves and the like, they just have an overgrown motocross bike. .



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  • Naru

Posted August 25, 2005 - 07:31 PM

#11

As much as I would like to give Honda the benefit of the doubt, when I look back on what Honda has done in the last few years things don't look promising. Between killing the XR line in spirit by rebadging the mini's, stopping production on two of their most indestructable bikes (XR 250 / 400), and creating woods bikes that need valves every 50 hours, I just have reservations about a new bike from them. I still wonder why the CRF-X models didn't get steel valves and more durable piston setups, as they are the new supposed trail bikes. I guess that "bigger, faster, lighter" not only sells bikes much faster out of the showroom, but helps keep the income flowing through OEM parts.

Most of the complaints on here and otherwise about the BRP seem to be from racers. Most of the people I've met who just ride the things for fun are more than happy to have a bike that they can flog into the ground, put away, and flog again the next day with no troubles. Last time I checked Honda's web page, I don't recall them selling it as a racing bike, but rather an open-class trail bike that has been successful in the Baja 1000. In other words, just because Honda races it and does well does not mean it's a race platform, except that many privateers have been successful fielding it as such. BMW ran a version of the 1200GS in Dakar, and KTM runs their 660 Rallye bikes (both with extreme modifications). But no one goes out with either publicly available counterpart and races it in a major event. In fact, that Honda can just go out and take their bike with relatively few modifications and win the Baja 1000 is quite a testament to it's engineering (if you exclude all of the supposed cheating and whatnot).

In any event, it's still great if they are in fact bringing a new big bore to their lineup, as innovation is a step foreward (even if it is into a silt bed). I just hope they remember to keep it reliable.

  • Supplicate

Posted August 25, 2005 - 07:58 PM

#12

Most of the complaints on here and otherwise about the BRP seem to be from racers.

:D

what?

Most of the stuff I've read from the guys that race the BRP's has only been mentioning how easy it is to build it into an open class race bike :D

  • Naru

Posted August 25, 2005 - 08:54 PM

#13

Thats very true. If you read closely, I'm not saying that all racers are complaining about the bike, but (it seems anyway) that most of the complaints, however many or few there are, come from people using the bike competatively. But then again, I guess if an average trail rider doesn't like the bike, they'll just sell it and buy something else, so I suppose you don't really hear from them. :D

  • irondude

Posted August 25, 2005 - 10:30 PM

#14

For sure the big bike is a rumor. Is Honda considering it? Of course. Has anyone ridden one in Baja? I really really really daubt it. But i dont know.
One thing is for certain:

About a month ago Johnny Campbell switched from parking his Team Honda painted up van beside his house on Mondays...and started parking the plain white unmarked Honda van that Bruce Ogilvie usually uses....the reason for this is obvious. The last thing Honda wants is to draw attention while going thru all the testing.

At least 2 guys i know with some knowledge on all this have confirmed that there is movement toward a new bike going on now. I will probably be yelled at for even writting that much! I cant say more.

If you dont buy the rumor then just use logic....

Someday--at some time in the future--the XR650R will be replaced.
Its going into its 7th year in a couple months..during that time dirt bikes in general have changed more than at any time since the mid-seventies. Ebutton, dual sport, mod suspension, pumper carbs, 4 valve heads, faster revs, Ti valves, etc all became the norm since the BRP was introduced...

So--if you agree that someday it will be replaced...

The question is--With what?

Option 1 is a bored out 450X...it might only have 550 or so cc's..but they call it a CRF600X -- its just stretching out the existing design with some obvious mods like a beafy crank, heavy flywheel, more oil capacity (oil cooler?), twin pipe, etc. It will be nice and light and very very fast. Plus easy for Honda to make...not unlike the Husky 510 and KTM 525 growing out of the 400/450 size. So yeah this bike is like the big Husaberg, Husky, or KTM XC525. Not hard to imagine at all.

Option 2 is a short stroke- a true 599cc's--- CRF600X. Purpose built with a 6 speed, 3 ring piston, wet sump, Unicam, high revs (for a big bike), but lower compression, a button. 270+ pounds, 60 hp...a bike that can still be fun/reliable when ridden in baja but also raced to La Paz. This will be unlike any other big bore. 4 valve heads just havent gotten past 510cc's---yet. It will also be a technology development venue for possible X bikes in the future. More X and less MX.

Option 3 is a revamped XR650R. Its basically just an updated XR with ebutton, modern suspension, pumper carb and a crash diet. Long stroke motor (possibly a unicam 4 valve on top of the existing 650R engine) and not low compression...say 10.25:1 ....This will be very similar to the '05 TE 610 Husqvarna--or an improved KTM LC4 like the bike KTM races in Baja.

Either bike will have the necessary upgrades:
Estart
Modern suspension
Lighter weight

I have ZERO knowledge of what the final bike will be like. But i do know that there will be one.


:D shakin, not stirred!

  • blueridge

Posted August 25, 2005 - 11:05 PM

#15

irondude, when do you think we'll see the new Honda... '07, '08, or '09?

  • irondude

Posted August 26, 2005 - 07:34 AM

#16

i honestly dont know.

my guess is '07.

  • huntmaster

Posted August 26, 2005 - 07:40 AM

#17

There were plenty of rumours being dismissed before that in the 90's about some new "liquid cooled" XR coming out too! And as the CRF prefix is being used pretty loosely now...everything from the old Z-50 to the XR-100 being renamed, I wouldn't worry too much about it necessarily being a fragile MX-based design..particularly if a full-on 600.


There were plenty of rumors flying about before the CRF450 debuted and then it finally appeared, but there are no guarantees about this bike until Honda makes a formal announcement and that won’t be coming for at least another year if ever and Honda will deny this bike exists until that time.



  • BWB63

Posted August 26, 2005 - 11:34 AM

#18

The engine for the next CR Motorcross bike? :D

  • qadsan

Posted August 26, 2005 - 11:52 AM

#19

The engine for the next CR Motorcross bike? :D


:eek: :eek: :D :D

This really gets the wheels inside a persons heading turning :eek:

  • BajaBoundMoto

Posted August 26, 2005 - 11:58 AM

#20

Honda will start racing the new CRF600 in Baja within a year.

I seriously doubt that.

About a month ago Johnny Campbell switched from parking his Team Honda painted up van beside his house on Mondays...and started parking the plain white unmarked Honda van that Bruce Ogilvie usually uses....the reason for this is obvious. The last thing Honda wants is to draw attention while going thru all the testing.

Funny thing there....his red & black van was hammered, he was offered a new one, it came but it was a new-used one that was hammered too. Waiting on another new one (or maybe has it by now).
I believe Iron Mike is reading more into this, you know, he's a pretty creative person.





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