Synthetic Oil, Clutch Slip?


29 replies to this topic
  • sausage boy

Posted May 29, 2005 - 05:43 PM

#1

hey TT I'm going to do my first oil change on a 2005 wr450, and i asked here what oil people are running, most people seam to be using synthetic or semi synthetic. when i went into my local Yamaha dealer he told me never use full or semi-synthetic in the WR as it will make the clutch slip. :)

  • WR Can Man

Posted May 29, 2005 - 05:55 PM

#2

Hi,
My 2004 WR 450 if using nothing but Amsoil. The first and still the best in synthetics. If they are telling you not to use it in your bike, then how come most of the road racers, and dirt racers use it around these parts? It is far superoior to anyone's lubes. Check out their website amoil.com. I am an Asmoil dealer, but there is no equal. This product is world famous amonst racers. Just because a race car for example has Mobile 1 on it, does not mean they are actually using it. But they will take the sponsership money. Do you think the Tour du France bikers that are sponsered by Gatorade or Powerade drink that stuff. Of course not its nothing but sugar water. Proffesional atheletes at that level, don't drink that stuff. This is a private company that does not answer to board of directors, and share holders. Ask around, its for real. My WR runs awesome with no clutch slippage.
Cheers,
Amsoil Dealer Bruce Low

  • 02YZ426

Posted May 29, 2005 - 06:12 PM

#3

According to my local Yamaha dealer, they say its real bad to run the engine with synthetic oil when the bike is still new.....or at least untill you have a few oil changes under you belt. I dont know about the clutch slip thing, I just use Motul oil and its not synthetic. I wouldnt waste the extra money on the synthetic stuff anyway, as long as you change your oil regular.

  • RADRick

Posted May 29, 2005 - 06:43 PM

#4

Most motorcycle-specific synthetics are compatible with clutches. Read the label, it will say if it is or isn't. Any new engine should be broken in with regular oil. The superior lubrication qualities of synthetics can interfere with proper ring seating and bearing wear-in. Once broken in, using synthetics can reduce wear, reduce operating temps, and prolong engine life. Avoid using any other additives; everything your engine needs is already in the oil.

  • farkawi

Posted May 29, 2005 - 07:23 PM

#5

I'm still breaking in my 05 WR450F and I'm doing it on Dino oil. Once I get 200 miles on it, it will get full synthetics for the duration. If you use motorcycle specific oils, you should not have any problems. I run synthetic oils in most of my bikes with no ill effects.

  • clark4131

Posted May 29, 2005 - 07:25 PM

#6

If this is your first oil change, hopefully you have very few miles on the bike. The original oil should be changed out ASAP as you will see all sorts of little metal flakes floating around in there. I'm a strong believer in breaking a bike in with nothing but a completely NON-synthetic dino oil due to its molecular structure and lubricating properties. Synthetics tend to have smaller molecules which result in lubrication at an even finer level. I know what you're saying..."Isn't that what I want?" After break-in, yes. But during break-in, synthetic oil can actually prevent your rings from seating properly which can later lead to blow-by, loss of horsepower and increased maintenance. I try to run dino-oil for at least the first 500 miles, or until the metal flakes decrease to a negligible level. Then I run nothing but Amsoil full synthetic. I've done this on all my bikes for the last 10 years with great results. Here's a great link extoling the virtues of this process...and another...and one more direct from Amsoil...SC

  • MN_Kevin

Posted May 30, 2005 - 01:48 AM

#7

If this is your first oil change, hopefully you have very few miles on the bike. The original oil should be changed out ASAP as you will see all sorts of little metal flakes floating around in there. I'm a strong believer in breaking a bike in with nothing but a completely NON-synthetic dino oil due to its molecular structure and lubricating properties. Synthetics tend to have smaller molecules which result in lubrication at an even finer level. I know what you're saying..."Isn't that what I want?" After break-in, yes. But during break-in, synthetic oil can actually prevent your rings from seating properly which can later lead to blow-by, loss of horsepower and increased maintenance. I try to run dino-oil for at least the first 500 miles, or until the metal flakes decrease to a negligible level. Then I run nothing but Amsoil full synthetic. I've done this on all my bikes for the last 10 years with great results. Here's a great link extoling the virtues of this process...and another...and one more direct from Amsoil...SC


use the "bean oil" again as recommended here.

I switched from Mobil 1 red cap to Shell Rotella T 5w-40 SYNTHETIC. I buy it at Wal-Mart in the 4 qt jugs.

This is a POPULAR bike oil, and DOES NOT have the friction reducers in it!

  • curtains23

Posted May 31, 2005 - 11:57 PM

#8

As they have said normal oil to break it in, then synthetics are fine, but make sure its for a motorcycle without ant friction modifiers as these will make the clutch slip, I use Motul v300 sport and change oil and filter every 7 hours (03 YZ450) this was recommended to me by a race team sponsored by another oil company but they chose to pay for another oil...nuff said

  • sausage boy

Posted June 01, 2005 - 03:33 PM

#9

thanks all. sasuage boy

  • RADRick

Posted June 01, 2005 - 07:33 PM

#10

I meant to include this in my first reply. Do NOT put much stock in what the pro racers use in or on their bikes. For one, while they may have one company's sticker on the bike, the stuff they actually use may be different. This dirty little secret is true in all forms of motorsports, especially where big-buck sponsorships are concerned. Second, unless you ride like one of those racers or have pockets as deep, what they use will have little relevance to your riding. Pro race engines are torn down after every race. Lubricants are often changed after every moto. It's likely your own bike and riding style will push a bike's lubricants beyond what a pro racer will. It's more likely your oil will see higher temperatures for longer intervals and more miles than a race bike ever will. The biggest test of an oil is not just its lubricity, but its thermal stability, resistance to viscosity breakdown and shear strength (ability to prevent metal to metal contact). When was the last time you saw a pro SX or MX rider DNF due to an oil failure? And a race mechanic is likely to underfill a pro bike to shave a few ounces knowing that a good synthetic will protect it long enough to finish a moto. The average rider isn't likely to do something like that on his/her personal ride. Take what you see the pros using with a grain of salt. When you have factory support, a backup bike, extra engines, a pro mechanic and the pressure to win at all costs, not to mention a fat sponsorship from an oil company, that logo on the bike is not always about the best product, but about the best exposure.

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  • lewichris

Posted June 01, 2005 - 07:57 PM

#11

yamalube 20-40, you know the recomended oil in your owners manual.

  • beezer

Posted June 01, 2005 - 08:14 PM

#12

One of the old wives tales is that you shouldn't use synthetic oil in a new motor. I run a new bike for about 2 minutes with the factory oil. I dump the oil and filter and put in Silkolene and a new filter.

I then ride the bike like someone else paid for it.

  • DeltaT

Posted June 01, 2005 - 09:05 PM

#13

I switched from Mobil 1 red cap to Shell Rotella T 5w-40 SYNTHETIC. I buy it at Wal-Mart in the 4 qt jugs.

This is a POPULAR bike oil, and DOES NOT have the friction reducers in it!


I agree and did the same thing. Rotella T Synthetic is $13.46 per gallon and is designed for the heavy turbo-diesels - even better specs than the "motorcycle-designed" lubes.

It's been 3 months since I started using it and no problems or slips.

Jim

  • RADRick

Posted June 02, 2005 - 09:56 AM

#14

One of the old wives tales is that you shouldn't use synthetic oil in a new motor. I run a new bike for about 2 minutes with the factory oil. I dump the oil and filter and put in Silkolene and a new filter.

I then ride the bike like someone else paid for it.

Show me one manufacturer that ships their vehicles with synthetic oil in them or recommends its use for break-in. Even the manufacturers of synthetic oils recommend against its use for break-in.

  • JTWR450

Posted June 02, 2005 - 10:09 AM

#15

Run the Yami-Lube semi synth with the gold cap. the stuff is the goods!! then again all these other folks have thei opinions as well. hell do what you want...I know I would

  • PBDBLUE

Posted June 02, 2005 - 10:20 AM

#16

Show me one manufacturer that ships their vehicles with synthetic oil in them or recommends its use for break-in. Even the manufacturers of synthetic oils recommend against its use for break-in.


My BMW 330i came with synthetic in it from the factory. I believe Corvettes are also shipped with synthetic. There are several other manufacturers that ship with synthetic in they're higher end models as well.

  • RADRick

Posted June 02, 2005 - 02:09 PM

#17

My BMW 330i came with synthetic in it from the factory. I believe Corvettes are also shipped with synthetic. There are several other manufacturers that ship with synthetic in they're higher end models as well.

I thought we were talking about motorcycles. :)

  • KiltLifter

Posted June 02, 2005 - 03:13 PM

#18

There's a little target on the back of the bottle. The center has the weight (20W40) the top half of the outer ring has the service rating SG, SF, etc. and the bottom ring SHOULD BE BLANK. If it says "energy conserving" it has the friction modifiers mentioned earlier and may cause clutch slip. Heavier Synthetics like Mobil1 15W50 do not have friction modifiers, some lighter weights do so check the target on back.

Personally for break-in I wouldn't use synthetic unless it comes that way from the factory (Porsche, Corvette, etc). These engines may be designed to use syn from the get-go.

  • PBDBLUE

Posted June 02, 2005 - 03:55 PM

#19

I thought we were talking about motorcycles. :)


I thought we were talking about 4-stroke engines.

  • RichBaker

Posted June 02, 2005 - 04:14 PM

#20

I thought we were talking about motorcycles. :)

You stated vehicles...., he gave you a correct answer! Most bike engines get broken-in on the production line....the mfgr. is simply trying to make it thru the warranty.




 
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