Dont buy FOX!



71 replies to this topic
  • fastkevin

Posted June 19, 2002 - 06:44 PM

#21

You guys that think Fox should give him a helmet at cost.. Are you aware of how many times Shoei, Arai etc.. are hit up for this ? Why should they? You walk in with a destroyed helmet, and they see that their product did it's job. You hit a tree in your new F150. The airbag is destroyed, and not re-usable, because THAT'S WHAT IT IS DESIGNED TO DO. The truck is destroyed, as the engineered in "crumple zones" did just that. Is Ford responsible to give you a new truck?

[ June 19, 2002: Message edited by: fastkevin ]

  • fastkevin

Posted June 19, 2002 - 06:45 PM

#22

:)

[ June 19, 2002: Message edited by: fastkevin ]

  • Yak

Posted June 19, 2002 - 06:46 PM

#23

fastkevin,

Believe me, the principles behind the helmet are not hard to grasp, there are many things like it, crumple zones,.. Bullet proof vests etc.. But one debate that comes to mind in the auto industry. Where do you draw the line between acceptable crumple zone damage and structural integrity? Same goes for this helmet. Where did FOX/KBC draw the line?..who knows..my bet is far to the crumple zone side. How can you say that this helmet did its job to a satisfactory level when a Shoei or Bell could have done the same job without the breakage. This is an assumption on my part, but Im willing to bet its true.


BTW, the most important safety advocate motocyclists have is the thing sitting between their ears.

  • Yak

Posted June 19, 2002 - 06:59 PM

#24

FastKevin,

To keep the debate rolling:

What if your airbag deployed in a 5-mph fender bender, then is it ford's fault? get it?

And the reason Fox "should" give me a helmet at cost is because to give me a helmet at COST does not COST them anything, but I might be a happy customer afterward and continue buying Fox products. So what is going to cost them more, $0 now and the potential for thousands later or $0 now and potential for $0 later. Its not a hard decision.

  • needsprayer

Posted June 19, 2002 - 07:03 PM

#25

Yak,

I agree that the helmet has a strange looking fracture. From what I see its does appear to have minor scratches and chips to the right of the fracture. However, as you say, there have been some slides.

I believe that FastKevin has something to offer:

"The Snell Foundation is entirely different however. As a person that's had his life saved on several occasions due to the efforts of the Snell Foundation..."

May I recommend you contact Snell with those pictures and offer the helmet for their examination. Of course you could inform FOX of the action you intend to take and see how they respond.

If you are sure of how this happened then by all means pursue this.

Personally, I have alot of FOX gear (boots, knee and arm pads). I just bought a FOX Flite helmet ($184) to replace a damaged AGV helmet (did its job and saved my head). The Flite is a great fit and has an excellent field of vision (reason I chose the Flite design). I have no complaints.

  • fastkevin

Posted June 19, 2002 - 07:06 PM

#26

Originally posted by Yak:
fastkevin,

Believe me, the principles behind the helmet are not hard to grasp, there are many things like it, crumple zones,.. Bullet proof vests etc.. But one debate that comes to mind in the auto industry. Where do you draw the line between acceptable crumple zone damage and structural integrity? Same goes for this helmet. Where did FOX/KBC draw the line?..who knows..my bet is far to the crumple zone side. How can you say that this helmet did its job to a satisfactory level when a Shoei or Bell could have done the same job without the breakage. This is an assumption on my part, but Im willing to bet its true.

BTW, the most important safety advocate motocyclists have is the thing sitting between their ears.


My first rr crash I took my helmet down to Shoei (which at the time was in Yorba Linda) for an inspection. They were more concerned about the foam shell than they were with the outer shell. They showed me where my head had clearly impacted it, and left a dent-rendering the helmet useless from then on out. They gave me a lot of info which I've used inspecting my helmet(s) after subsequent crashes. They also thanked me for not trying to grind a new helmet out of them, and explained that people sometimes don't grasp the concept behind what a helmet is intended to do.
YAK,
If you think the helmet was defective, be thankful that it failed now, instead at a more critical time.
Go try a Shoei and an Arai on
Whichever fits you best-buy it, and put this behind you

:)
BTW: I can e-mail you a pic of a Bell M-6 with a crack very similar to yours. It happened as a result of a 40mph high-side, with my head being whipped into the ground. I'm not saying this has anything to do with your damage, just giving you some perspective of what Fox (et.al.) see(s) frequently

[ June 19, 2002: Message edited by: fastkevin ]

  • moto_madman

Posted June 19, 2002 - 07:08 PM

#27

I have a KBC helmet. It beat the hell out of it for two years on mountain bike and dirt bike. It is holding up fine.

Dont say KBC helmets are junk because they make Fox helmets. Just because they make them dosent mean they are the same. Alpinestars makes boots for MSR. MSR's lower end boots have buckles that break easily. Does that mean Alpinestars are junk too?

  • fastkevin

Posted June 19, 2002 - 07:23 PM

#28

Originally posted by Yak:
FastKevin,

To keep the debate rolling:

What if your airbag deployed in a 5-mph fender bender, then is it ford's fault? get it?

And the reason Fox "should" give me a helmet at cost is because to give me a helmet at COST does not COST them anything, but I might be a happy customer afterward and continue buying Fox products. So what is going to cost them more, $0 now and the potential for thousands later or $0 now and potential for $0 later. Its not a hard decision.

Do you realize what you're saying? After all of your posts slamming the Fox helmet, YOU'D BE WILLING TO PUT ONE BACK ON YOUR HEAD IF THE PRICE IS RIGHT. Hell, wearing no helmet is free..

[ June 20, 2002: Message edited by: fastkevin ]

  • Blade275

Posted June 19, 2002 - 07:38 PM

#29

why don't we all be happy and just buy thor stuff.
everything I have is thor excapt for my boots and goggles :)

  • grashoper250

Posted June 19, 2002 - 07:43 PM

#30

Sounds like Fox won't even look at it, that's what disappoints me about the whole thing.

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  • Guest_mxrider426_*

Posted June 19, 2002 - 07:57 PM

#31

If the helmet cracked so easily, then if he had a worse fall it would have cracked in half. Now that isn't what a helmet is supposed to do.

  • Yak

Posted June 19, 2002 - 08:07 PM

#32

grashoper250,

I sent my helmet in on the 7th, it arrived on the 10th at fox, signed for by the recieving counter. I called after 3 days, they claimed to have been backed up and told me they would get to it. After 9, yes 9, days after it arrived at fox they still hadnt opened it yet, I asked the lady to look for it as it has been too long. She opened it up, said "wow" thats strange. Took it too her supervisor, after 2 minutes told me no deal, its crash damage. So they did actually glance at. Both of the women with their huge riding background and in depth helmet knowledge were able to make the assesment so quickly, they truly are special employees. ..

  • MMotohead

Posted June 19, 2002 - 08:27 PM

#33

In my experience, Fox riding gear is overpriced and not durable. I have protested Fox products for years. Good marketing, bad products.

  • grashoper250

Posted June 19, 2002 - 08:42 PM

#34

I agree, I'm sure they checked the foam to look for a head impact too, Right? I guess you could do what bambislayer suggested earlier, but more importantly, spend your money somewhere else. If it's a bad product It'll get around. That photo was enough to sway me from buying one. I know helmets are generally good for one tough blow but it's been my experience that they generally take a beating (foam included) before they are no good. Sorry guy, I now it's a big blow to the wallet.

  • yamaha.dude

Posted June 19, 2002 - 11:05 PM

#35

Just as a point of reference...

FOX Pilot helmets were not available in Australia for most of last year, because they had been recalled. The Australian Standard is a little different to the US one, so obviously each helmet is made to a specification handed down from the Company who is going to sell them retail.

The manufacturer just follows the spec given to them. I don't know what was wrong with the recalled ones, but they were nice looking helmets in the ads, fairly expensive etc... but all that counts for nothing if they are defective and unable to do their job properly in a big get-off...

I sprung for a Shoei - figured I didn't have a ten-buck head, so I should not get a ten-buck helmet...

I would get the dealer you bought it from to have a talk to the FOX rep and see what they can do to restore your faith in the willingness of FOX to stand behind it's products and the customers who buy them.

I am happy with the FOX gloves, jersey and pants I have, but the helmets seem to be developing a track record... I agree that it doesn't look like general crash damage, more like a stress fracture or manufacturing flaw, unless the thing that hit yor helmet was like a waterpipe and produce concentrated impact...

David

[ June 20, 2002: Message edited by: yamaha.dude ]

  • CAL

Posted June 20, 2002 - 02:34 AM

#36

Originally posted by fastkevin:

I have several hemlets that have been destroyed by crashes, but saved my head in the process. THAT IS THEIR ONLY PURPOSE.
I'm willing to bet that the foam behind the crack is dented (you can tell because it's painted black over white for the purpose of inspection), WHICH WOULD MEAN THE FOAM ABSORBED THE IMPACT OF YOUR HEAD. You need to eduate yourself on the subject, and then go back and edit your post.


Preach on!

Kevin is 100% correct. A helmet IS a one time use product. One blow to a helmet, and it has served it's purpose. You can drop a helemt on the ground from 3-4 feet and it will damage the helmet to the point of needing replacement. And the foam does all the work. The shell is just that...a shell.

You are so determined to have FOX replace the helmet?? You said the helmet is 2 months old. I don't know of any MX or offroad gear that has a warantee longer than 30 days. Sorry, but you used your helmet and it served it's purpose. That reason alone is why I think it's ridiculous to pay $350 for a helmet. If a helmet is Snell approved then safety wise, it's just as good as any other helmet that is Snell approved.

  • Sean_McCutcheon

Posted June 20, 2002 - 02:40 AM

#37

Fox is not worth the extra money. Too many of my friends have had trouble with chest protectors craking and boots falling apart. I stay away from fox and buy AXO.

  • beezer

Posted June 20, 2002 - 03:28 AM

#38

I don't think that helmet should have cracked like that. And they should have replaced the helmet. A satisfied customer tells 2 or 3 people. A dissatified customer can tell hundreds if not thousands with the internet. I think you should write the president of the company a certified letter stating the problem you had with their helmet. It sounds like you got 2 low level discourteous employees. Let the president know what happened. It's a smart business decision to stand behind your products. It has already cost them more than cost of the helmet in lost sales. How many people that will read your post would buy a Fox helmet? But they may have done you a favor in the long run as it seems to me they sell an inferior product. You could have been really hurt in a harder crash. I'll never buy one of their helmets.

  • JSTheJack

Posted June 20, 2002 - 03:39 AM

#39

Bummer.

BELL Helmets. Big $$$, but worth it in my opinion.

  • MateoB

Posted June 20, 2002 - 03:57 AM

#40

Along with the letter I would print out and include a copy of this string and show them how many people may have been pursuaded into not buying a Fox helmet or maybe even Fox products in general in the future because of their decision not to replace a helmet that I'm sure costs them very little to produce in the scope of things. Not very smart marketing...

Only problem with this approach is that you would probably not get a new helmet after all the negative publicity resulting from your post. But maybe they may want the thread to end with somethig like Fox agreed to replace the helmet. Buy Fox, they stand by their product! :)





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