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2016 WR450 Suspension, Front end wiped out.


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21 replies to this topic
  • Ka0sX

    TT Bronze Member

179 posts
Location: Australia

Posted September 13, 2016 - 02:29 AM


Well i set my sag to 110 with full gear, everything stock except front forks comp from stock went 2 clicks out, also rear stock + 2 clicks out golden screw , Everything was fine was pretty slippery and muddy , wet

 

, Seen a tree root instead of maybe hitting it straight on,

 

I hit it at probably at 45 degree angle and front end went left and dropped the bike as it slid out from under me i know it might be user error and shit happens,

 

But is there any way i might be able to rectify it from it not happening again ?

 

 

Stock tires and stock air compression, Sticker on swing arms says recommended air pressure 14l bs, But i do find i get alot of tire spin even and soft and hard dirt, Would lowering the air pressure in the front and rear fix it ? Stock everything except what i changed

 

 

Cheers 



  • stevethe

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5,230 posts
Location: California
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Posted September 13, 2016 - 03:42 AM


Newer rider error. You kinda of need to jump roots and downed trees at times. Hit them as straight as you can. Sometimes the front will be the easy one but with the rear you almost have to pull up with the gas off so it doesn't slid out. Sometimes we hit it with momentum then use the clutch and just get over it.

Changing tire pressure is good. It's a matter of trail and error. We run about 11 psi in the front. The rears we use big 140 IRCm5b with 3 - 4 PSI. On the stock rear you will need more air. But you should really try many different set ups to see what you really like. Definitely don't run stock air pressure.

Edited by stevethe, September 13, 2016 - 03:45 AM.


  • Spiritwalker2222

    TT Bronze Member

290 posts
Location: Ontario

Posted September 13, 2016 - 04:45 AM


Softening your compression will help with the roots. Also lowering your air pressure. I run 12 and 5 psi, front and rear respectively.

 

If you see a rock before the roots, hit it to jump or at least unweight your suspension. Especially if your hitting at an off angle.

 

 

Edit, Out of curiosity I just checked the manual's recommended tire pressure. 22 and 29, wow, that would make the bike feel like crap.


Edited by Spiritwalker2222, September 13, 2016 - 04:49 AM.


  • Ka0sX

    TT Bronze Member

179 posts
Location: Australia

Posted September 13, 2016 - 04:45 AM


So i doubled checked and stock PSI is 15 PSI, Now i have wound everything out and going to go in to stock setting as i did find the left side out by 1 click to what the right was

 

What would you guys classify as a medium between hard-soft -sand-wet/slipery

 

 

Terry Hay from Australia mentioned this in a post i seen

 

Cheers

 

Forks
Comp 18 out
Rebound 12 out
Shock
High speed 1 turn out " Will leave stock setting and see how i go "
Low speed 15 out
Rebound 16 out.
 
Also what do you recommend for tire air pressure rear and front for all kinds of terraine

Edited by Ka0sX, September 13, 2016 - 04:50 AM.


  • Ka0sX

    TT Bronze Member

179 posts
Location: Australia

Posted September 13, 2016 - 04:59 AM


Softening your compression will help with the roots. Also lowering your air pressure. I run 12 and 5 psi, front and rear respectively.

 

If you see a rock before the roots, hit it to jump or at least unweight your suspension. Especially if your hitting at an off angle.

 

 

Edit, Out of curiosity I just checked the manual's recommended tire pressure. 22 and 29, wow, that would make the bike feel like crap.

 

 

Sticker on swing arm says 15 PSI front and rear, have not changed a thing other then top fork clikers and middle rear clickers "GOLD screw" Witch is the middle

 

Bike is 12 days old didnt touch a thing other then what i have mentioned 


Edited by Ka0sX, September 13, 2016 - 05:01 AM.


  • stevethe

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5,230 posts
Location: California
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Posted September 13, 2016 - 05:14 AM


The suspension isn't even broken in yet. The adjustments are based on your weight. The bike is set up for a rider weighing about 180 +lbs.

  • Ka0sX

    TT Bronze Member

179 posts
Location: Australia

Posted September 13, 2016 - 05:41 AM


The suspension isn't even broken in yet. The adjustments are based on your weight. The bike is set up for a rider weighing about 180 +lbs.

 

 

I weighed myself without what i wear and iam 89kilo, With boots helmet gloves pants i'am 94 kilo, I normally wear just mx jersey boots gloves helmet jeans, Cell phone in pocket, Some times depends on ride will be small back pack. With phone smokes 2x 500ml bottle water that's it, Am always about 15 to 20 mins walking distance to my trailer / With other people there at camp site wife friends etc         

 

202 k's on the clock


Edited by Ka0sX, September 13, 2016 - 05:43 AM.


  • stevethe

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5,230 posts
Location: California
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Posted September 13, 2016 - 05:55 AM


The bike should be pretty well set up for your weight. It is just too new and not broken in yet. You need more ride time on her.

  • Ka0sX

    TT Bronze Member

179 posts
Location: Australia

Posted September 13, 2016 - 06:06 AM


The bike should be pretty well set up for your weight. It is just too new and not broken in yet. You need more ride time on her.

 

 

okie i get that nees time to break in like the engine witch has 10 tone more pwer now at the same revs lol, Wants to go to the moon and back i'am comfortable with that,

 

But when coming out of corners how can i keep the back wheel following the front ? Even in some whoops i hit, It Felt like the LEFT side wanted to dive in, Could that be the reason why i feel the left side wanting to take a dive ?

 

Basically at stock settings bike handled woops like a magic carpet front was staraight as hell. Changed sag nothing else , but same section felt like bike wanted to go to the RIGHT

 

Hope i explained that right

 

Cheers

 

 

 

EDIT

 

 

Or is back following the front and i'am not used to the sliding out on rear end 

 

But i do think tire pressure could be an issue 


Edited by Ka0sX, September 13, 2016 - 06:15 AM.


  • stevethe

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Location: California
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Posted September 13, 2016 - 06:23 AM


It shouldn't go left or right unless you fell and the forks twisted in the triple clamps. If so, look at them and loosen pinch bolts and straighten then tighten.

 

If you really want to know what compression does on the forks loosen the screw five turns and ride it. That should make a hugh difference that you would feel to know if your going in the right direction. But remember after a bike breaks in it gets looser.



  • Ka0sX

    TT Bronze Member

179 posts
Location: Australia

Posted September 13, 2016 - 08:03 AM


It shouldn't go left or right unless you fell and the forks twisted in the triple clamps. If so, look at them and loosen pinch bolts and straighten then tighten.

 

If you really want to know what compression does on the forks loosen the screw five turns and ride it. That should make a hugh difference that you would feel to know if your going in the right direction. But remember after a bike breaks in it gets looser.

 

 

Thanks for your help mate, I have just put the following because i ride a combo of what is, Hardpack  /  soft like sand in some situations, the odd time i to rough stuff like rocks etc etc, Aussie outback terrain is really unpredictable. not looking for magic carpet ride but something in between

 

 

Again sag is set to 110 with gear includes jeans/boots/helmet/gloves 94kilo

 

Without gear roughly 89 kilo

 

Sag is 110mm Race / Static 30mm

 

 

Forks
Comp 18 out
Rebound 12 out
 
Shock
High speed 1 turn out  " didnt touch from stock rest is changed"
 
Low speed 15 out
Rebound 16 out.
 
 
Will give them ago in the morning and see how i go
 
EDIT 
 
Will record with go pro and edit to terrain i think iam sloppy in

Edited by Ka0sX, September 13, 2016 - 08:24 AM.


  • MidlifeCrisisGuy

    TT Platinum Member

1,872 posts
Location: Other

Posted September 13, 2016 - 09:01 AM


The rears we use big 140 IRCm5b with 3 - 4 PSI.

 

That is insanely low pressure.   I run the same tire down to 8 PSI and it feels like a marshmallow in corners.  3-4 PSI ?   Really ?  What are you using for a tube ?

 

If you want better performance from an M5B, slice the big middle knobs in half down the center so they flex better.   I like the Michelin S12XC better than the M5B, but it doesn't last as long.  These are both everyday riding tires, of course, not all out racing tires.

 

The best everyday riding front tire for slippery conditions is an IRC Vulcanduro VE35F at as low pressure as you dare.  8PSI, but be careful on rocks. Grips slippery logs better than anything.

 

The key to getting the back tire over a slippery root at an angle with a big 4 stroke is to pull the clutch in while rolling over it with momentum.  If you don't pull the clutch in and you have too much throttle, the rear will spin out sideways on the root.  If you don't have enough throttle the engine braking will cause it to slip sideways.  Momentum is your friend.  You can't power over a slippery root.  You have to roll over it using momentum.



  • Monk
23,738 posts
Location: British Columbia
Garage View Garage

Posted September 13, 2016 - 09:37 AM


Square up the root, leave suspension alone... Changing the suspension to compensate for shitty riding 'moment' wont help...

  • GHILL28

    TT Addict

3,838 posts
Location: California

Posted September 13, 2016 - 09:45 AM


The stock tubes in these bikes are usually wafer thin.  If you run low pressures at all (or even medium pressures), you'll literally wear holes in the wall of the tube.  It's kind of funny to see, as long as it doesn't strand you somewhere.

 

First things first, get some real tubes in there, then run 8-10psi for offroad.  If you're serious about traction, then NueTech Tubliss.

 

I'm more and more curious about the M5B rear.  I hate the idea of running the tires SUPER flat and soft, because they get hard to initiate leans into corners with.  Certain casings like the AT81RC I've been able to run 5psi or less through the fast desert tagging rocks and never feel the rim.  There's THAT much casing there.



  • Monk
23,738 posts
Location: British Columbia
Garage View Garage

Posted September 13, 2016 - 09:48 AM


The stock tubes in these bikes are usually wafer thin. If you run low pressures at all (or even medium pressures), you'll literally wear holes in the wall of the tube. It's kind of funny to see, as long as it doesn't strand you somewhere.

First things first, get some real tubes in there, then run 8-10psi for offroad. If you're serious about traction, then NueTech Tubliss.

I'm more and more curious about the M5B rear. I hate the idea of running the tires SUPER flat and soft, because they get hard to initiate leans into corners with. Certain casings like the AT81RC I've been able to run 5psi or less through the fast desert tagging rocks and never feel the rim. There's THAT much casing there.


M5B sucks...almost as bad as a AT81...

  • stevethe

    Get Help Now

5,230 posts
Location: California
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Posted September 13, 2016 - 09:51 AM


That is insanely low pressure.   I run the same tire down to 8 PSI and it feels like a marshmallow in corners.  3-4 PSI ?   Really ?  What are you using for a tube ?
 
If you want better performance from an M5B, slice the big middle knobs in half down the center so they flex better.   I like the Michelin S12XC better than the M5B, but it doesn't last as long.  These are both everyday riding tires, of course, not all out racing tires.
 
The best everyday riding front tire for slippery conditions is an IRC Vulcanduro VE35F at as low pressure as you dare.  8PSI, but be careful on rocks. Grips slippery logs better than anything.
 
The key to getting the back tire over a slippery root at an angle with a big 4 stroke is to pull the clutch in while rolling over it with momentum.  If you don't pull the clutch in and you have too much throttle, the rear will spin out sideways on the root.  If you don't have enough throttle the engine braking will cause it to slip sideways.  Momentum is your friend.  You can't power over a slippery root.  You have to roll over it using momentum.


Ultra heavy duty tubes.

M5B sucks...almost as bad as a AT81...


Best tire for our terrian.

  • MidlifeCrisisGuy

    TT Platinum Member

1,872 posts
Location: Other

Posted September 13, 2016 - 10:21 AM


What are you using for everyday, soft/slippery woods tires, Monk ?

 

BTW, I ran a Kenda Equilibrium for most of the spring/summer and gave up trying to find conditions that it was better than conventional knobby.  I think it was somewhat better on slippery roots, but it was a lot worse on loose shale and once it packs with mud, it is essentially a slick.  In  the right conditions, it packs frequently.


Edited by MidlifeCrisisGuy, September 13, 2016 - 10:22 AM.


  • Monk
23,738 posts
Location: British Columbia
Garage View Garage

Posted September 13, 2016 - 10:23 AM


What are you using for everyday, soft/slippery woods tires, Monk ?

BTW, I ran a Kenda Equilibrium for most of the spring/summer and gave up trying to find conditions that it was better than conventional knobby. I think it was somewhat better on slippery roots, but it was a lot worse on loose shale and once it packs with mud, it is essentially a slick. In the right conditions, it packs frequently.


Michelin Starcross 5 soft

  • GHILL28

    TT Addict

3,838 posts
Location: California

Posted September 13, 2016 - 10:27 AM


Yeah the M5B has its applications in REALLY deep soft crap.  I don't think I would use that as a go-to for hardpack or light silt.



  • MidlifeCrisisGuy

    TT Platinum Member

1,872 posts
Location: Other

Posted September 13, 2016 - 10:29 AM


Michelin Starcross 5 soft

 

I don't find a lot of difference between the S12XC and the M5B, except wear.

 

Is the Starcross 5 soft a lot better than the S12XC ?

 

https://m.fortnine.c...ad_position.jpg

 

Yeah the M5B has its applications in REALLY deep soft crap.  I don't think I would use that as a go-to for hardpack or light silt.

 

Agreed.  But in soft and slippery, it is a good everyday tire.  It isn't a Goldentire or anything like that. 


Edited by MidlifeCrisisGuy, September 13, 2016 - 10:30 AM.





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