No Toil Comments/Thoughts?

14 replies to this topic
  • RichB

Posted March 29, 2002 - 06:02 AM



I recently switched to no toil filter oil and I love the cleaning process however, I am a little concerned about the filtering capability.

The first thing I have noticed is I'm having a hard time switching from from spray can application to the immersion process that the liquid requires. Seems like the bike is runs like crap the first hour or so on a fresh filter i.e. running rich. I'm thinking it's sucking some fluid through the carb for a while then stabilizes out. I always squeeze out the excess oil and let it sit AT LEAST overnight before I ride it, what else am I missing?????

The second thing, and the thing that worries me the most is the filter doesn't seem to be getting dirty (collecting dust etc) nowhere near the rate as when I was using "regular" filter oil. Also, I noticed a very light coat of dust inside the air boot this week when I had the filter off that I don't remember ever having before.

The third thing I notice is that when I used conventional filter oil and I touched the filter a long thread of tacky goo would extened off the element. When I touch the filter oiled with no-toil it's not near as tacky.

Any thoughts??????

p.s. I grease the lip and make sure the filter is seated against the rim so I know that's not the prob.

  • Hokie

Posted March 29, 2002 - 06:24 AM


I have been using No-Toil exclusively for the last 2.5 years, on a YZ400 and YZ426.

I have not noticed any of the problems that you mentioned. However, I do not do an immersion oiling process.

I out the filter in a platic grocery store bag and pour the oil onto the filter then work it around until the filter is covered. (Turns red from the dye in the oil) Pouring on more oil as needed.

I have not been greasing the filter lip lately since I bought a Moose aftermarket filter. The lip seems to be pretty thick and I get a good seal just from the pressure of the air filter cage. I do let some filter oil get on the lip though for a light seal I guess.

I have used other filter oils in a pinch (Bel Ray I think) and the dirt collection on the filter seemed to be about the same to me. Granted, the spray on stuff does seem to be way more tacky at application time.

Also, at one point you could get the No-Toil oil in a spray can. Not sure if they are still doing that or not.

  • neWRiver

Posted March 29, 2002 - 06:44 AM


Well, I've not had these issues with no-toil and I think your problems may lie somewhere in how you apply the oil.

A couple thoughts come to mind:

- Make sure you have thouroughly cleaned the filter of any previous conventional filter oil.

- Don't put too much on. I have found that complete immersion results in a very wet filter and squeezing out the excess is quite a task. I put my filter in plastic bag and add the appropriate amount of oil and just keep working it until the filter is evenly coated. If I ended up over wetting it, I just squeeze it in some paper towels to remove the excess. (BTW, I see that they now offer an aerosol spray can which I would like to try).

- No-toil seems to me to be a bit lighter (thinner) and tackier in its working state. Out of the bottle it is very "wet" due to the carrier agent (achohol based I believe). Make sure you SHAKE the bottle well before using it. The carrier is intended to evaporate and has no filtering capability.

I'm guessing that the richness you are experiencing is from an over wetted application. In this state I would expect that you could pull some liguid through your carb and also that the oil may be migrating from the top of the filter toward the bottom.

  • RichB

Posted March 29, 2002 - 06:48 AM



Immersion probably wasn't the right word to use. I too, am basically oiling the filter the same as you only I'm using a jumbo sized plastic zip loc.

  • bbeakley

Posted March 29, 2002 - 07:56 AM


I was thumbing through my Rocky Mountain MC spring/summer catalog over Cocoa Pebbles this morning and noticed that they carry No Toil filter oil in an aerosol spray can. I too had the same observations about the liquid oil and thought about switching to this when I'm finished with the existing liquid bottle. One other TT'er mentioned that he put his liquid into a spray bottle and squirted it onto the filter. He indicated this resulted better saturation without as much excess being applied.

As for the visible dirt on the filter, I would gauge how dirty the water gets when you clean the filter vs. your other filter/oil combos. The NoToil filter may just "hide" the trapped dirt in the foam moreso than the stocker. Mine doesn't look near as dirty after the first ride as my stock filter did after one ride using PJ1 tacky spray oil. I haven't cleaned it yet to see how much dirt it's retaining.

  • RichB

Posted March 29, 2002 - 08:08 AM


bbeakley - Good points. I will try the spray bottle idea. That may take care of the excess saturation. I'm still a little leary of the dirt trapping though, maybe it is hiding it in the foam but a lot more stuff got trapped on the outside of the filter when I was using PJ1. Plus, I don't like the fact that I see some light dust on the intake tract.

Also, I'm gonna make sure I shake the h-e double hockey sticks out of it before I use it next time. (maybe I haven't been shaking it up enough?)

Thanks for the input!

  • Hokie

Posted March 29, 2002 - 08:21 AM


Originally posted by RichB:

Also, I'm gonna make sure I shake the h-e double hockey sticks out of it before I use it next time. (maybe I haven't been shaking it up enough?)

Thanks for the input!

Definitely shake that bottle! I noticed that if you are pouring out the oil and it is not red then it seems to be really thin.

Just for the record, I did not like the spray on oil. But I also did not like the spray on Bel Ray or PJ1 either. Probably just personal preference since I was used to doing it the plastic bag and pour on the oil way.

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  • Shane

Posted March 29, 2002 - 09:40 AM


If all these things you say happen like, the thin dirt layer on the inside of the air filter and, it not being as tacky, then why dont you just switch? Maybe after what these guys said it will fix the problem but otherwise i would say ditch the no toil!

  • MOmilkman

Posted March 29, 2002 - 09:54 AM



My expierence with the No-Toil is just about the same as you have had.
When I first got the stuff it seemed like a killer idea, and it is, but I am with you.

The No-Toil is definatly not as tacky as other spray on filter oil's. I used the Maxxima Fab-1 for years before the No-Toil and now I am back on the Fab-1 again.

Here was the biggest problem I had with it though.
(If ANYONE else has had this problem, please let me know)
When I first started using the no-toil I put in a brand new Uni-Filter. After about 3-4 washings (by hand, in a bucket) the filter lip started seperating from the filer (where it is glued on)

So I thought, ok, defective filter. Went and bought a new filter, same thing again. Once more I went to the store bought a new filter and it happened a 3rd time.

After that I bought a 4th new UniFilter and went back to using the Fab-1 and I have been using the same filter for about 3 years now.

I have been hestitant about mentioning this because I figured people would just say it was the filter, but I believe it was the oil causing it.

  • neWRiver

Posted March 29, 2002 - 10:21 PM



It has been mentioned and I have experienced myself that no-toil attacks some foam filter construction adhesives. Most notibly, I also had a UNI come unglued on me. I did not go through 3 filters to figure it out because I had heard of this problem. I just switched filters. No-toil actually sells a line of filters that will not fall apart and appear to be of at least equal quality to other brands I've used.

I'm not hesitant at all to say that no-toil will make a UNI filter come unglued. People should know. :)

  • Hokie

Posted March 29, 2002 - 12:24 PM


That is true.
No-Toil made my uni come unglued too.

The Moose one seems to be holding up OK.

The No-Toil filters are great also.

  • z4me

Posted March 29, 2002 - 12:27 PM


For the record - I have had no problems with the stuff decomposing my stock Yamaha filter or my Twin Air filter.

About the filtering capabilities - very interesting. I wounder if there could be a standard test performed to determine filtering capabilities of the various products.

I really like how clean the filters come out when I stick them in the washing machine - don't tell my wife :)

  • aag800

Posted March 29, 2002 - 12:51 PM


I wrote to UNI and no-toil when my filters fell apart. UNI told me to go scratch and that no-toil was junk. No-toil told me about the prob. with UNI's and sent me two free no-toil filters. Based on the customer service alone, i would stick with no-toil. But I have been using it since it hit the shelves in four different bikes, with nothing bad to say about it. -Adam-

  • sirthumpalot

Posted March 29, 2002 - 01:06 PM


I have heard from more than one person who said that the no toil was letting some fine dust through. I'm wondering if it works well in non-dusty areas but is not so good for dusty areas. I'm sticking with regular filter oil for now.

  • RichB

Posted March 29, 2002 - 01:26 PM


I think I'm going to ditch it myself. I've lived in the desert (here and in new mexico) for 10 years now and haven't blown up 1 bike and I don't want to start now.

I LOVE the cleaning aspect of this stuff but I'm not willing to sacrifice an engine (especially a YZF engine!)

Gotta go and update my signature now......

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