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2016 yz450f.jpg

Yamaha YZ450F (2016)


Owner: Goof331
Added on Yesterday, 06:31 AM


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16 450F Triple Clamps


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61 replies to this topic
  • CSAR FE

    TT Bronze Member

124 posts
Location: New Mexico
Garage View Garage

Posted March 09, 2016 - 01:12 PM


I'm looking to get a set of Ride Engineering triple clamps in either 22mm or 20mm. I'm leaning towards the 22mm set in hopes of striking a balance between easier turning and stability, but do you guys have any recommendations? Anyone running aftermarket clamps?



  • Monk
23,706 posts
Location: British Columbia
Garage View Garage

Posted March 09, 2016 - 01:40 PM


I would look for some cheap used 10-15 clamps and try them first. If you like the feel you can always sell them and upgrade to the RE clamps or such...

  • mxred147

    TT Member

66 posts
Location: Illinois

Posted March 23, 2016 - 05:48 PM


I would look for some cheap used 10-15 clamps and try them first. If you like the feel you can always sell them and upgrade to the RE clamps or such...

thats exactly what i have done, will post results after i ride this weekend.



  • CSAR FE

    TT Bronze Member

124 posts
Location: New Mexico
Garage View Garage

Posted March 23, 2016 - 06:50 PM


How much did you pay for them? I'm seeing prices around $220 + shipping on flea bay. For that price, I'll shell out the extra and buy Ride Eng clamps.



  • burp

    TT Newbie

7 posts
Location: Tennessee

Posted April 01, 2016 - 08:45 AM


what's wrong with the original ones?



  • grayracer513
42,876 posts
Location: California
Garage View Garage

Posted April 01, 2016 - 08:59 AM


A reasonable question.



  • rob298mx

    TT Member

66 posts
Location: New Hampshire
Garage View Garage

Posted April 07, 2016 - 01:06 PM


i am curious to see how the 22mm clamps work on this bike..



  • Krannie McKranface
36,164 posts
Location: California
Garage View Garage

Posted April 07, 2016 - 01:36 PM


what's wrong with the original ones?

 

New YZ's have more clamp offset than previous years

 

chassis-rake_trail_zpsoa9zvuks.gif



  • grayracer513
42,876 posts
Location: California
Garage View Garage

Posted April 07, 2016 - 07:50 PM


Well, that's true and it isn't.  All the YZ clamps from something like '97 up through '09 were all 25mm offset.  That changed in 2010 when the YZ450 went to a 22mm offset, and now it's back at 25 again.

 

So, it's more than the previous models, but not the ones previous to that, if you follow.

 

You should end up with a '16 that handles almost exactly like a '15. 



  • counteru

    TT Member

86 posts
Location: Tennessee

Posted April 08, 2016 - 04:11 AM


New YZ's have more clamp offset than previous years

 

I understand, I suppose I should have clarified. I mean what's wrong as in why would one want to go from the 25mm offset to the 22mm offset? What would that achieve? I am just trying to figure out what's "bad" or what one hopes to fix by going from the 25mm to the 22. Thanks



  • Krannie McKranface
36,164 posts
Location: California
Garage View Garage

Posted April 08, 2016 - 04:33 AM


 

New YZ's have more clamp offset than previous years

 

I understand, I suppose I should have clarified. I mean what's wrong as in why would one want to go from the 25mm offset to the 22mm offset? What would that achieve? I am just trying to figure out what's "bad" or what one hopes to fix by going from the 25mm to the 22. Thanks

 

 

 

http://motocrossacti...le-clamp-offset



  • grayracer513
42,876 posts
Location: California
Garage View Garage

Posted April 08, 2016 - 06:55 AM


 

There are some inaccuracies in that piece.  I love the part where they say it should do one thing but "for some reason" it does another. 

 

All the geometric stuff is true enough.  Reducing offset increases trail, which is the distance the tire contact point "trails" behind the steering axis, just like they said.  And increased trail generally increases the caster effect, but the caster effect is speed sensitive, and doesn't really kick in until you exceed 25 or 30 MPH.  Most corners on modern MX tracks are that speed or lower. 

 

What causes the change in clamp offset to change the way the steering feels in a turn is that increasing trial (reducing offset) is the change in trail, but it's not the caster effect.  You notice that if you sit on the bike or stand next to it and lean it to the left without holding the bars that the front wheel turns to the left.  That is because the weight of the bike is now pushing partly in the lateral and the weight at the front is borne by the front tire contact point, which is behind the steering axis, which is free to turn.  So, the bike's own weight makes the front want to self steer to an extent, and increasing trail increases that tendency. 

 

Now you have to consider a couple more things.  The bike leans in to stay balanced against centrifugal force in a turn, and the height of the bike's center of mass dictates how much it mus lean to balance things out.  High CG's don't need much lean, low CG's need quite a bit.  Next, there is the fact that a wheel all by itself when leaned left and rolled will roll in a circle to the left because part of the tire in contact with the ground curves up and left instead of up and straight over.  A leaning wheel steers itself.

 

So, you take these two things and put them together and you have factors that determine the natural lean angle, and from that, factors that determine the self steer of the leaning wheel.  Along with that, you throw in the tendency of the front to "gravity steer" as we mentioned farther up, and you come up with what amounts to the uncorrected natural chassis behavior.  By changing the offset, you will alter what the bike tends to do in a low speed (say 30 mph or less) corner.  If it wants to go straight, you can either lean it in under you, or reduce the offset to make it want to turn in more on its own.  If it always seems to turn in too much, you can lean inside the bike to stand it up more, or you can increase the offset to reduce the trail. 

 

As the article mentioned, there are a lot of physical factors involved in the matter, and it's a bit much to get your head all the way around.  Another odd thing is that while on paper, more trail increases the caster effect, and that should make the bike more stable at speed, it doesn't always work that way in the dirt.  The surface is not even.  When the surface tilts up to the left, the contact zone of the front tire shifts to the left as well.  When going straight on a flat surface, the drag from the center of the tire tread pulls the center of contact in behind the steering axis and makes the bike go straight.  When it tils up to the left, the contact point still wants to pull in behind the steering axis, but now, the contact point is out to the left a ways, so by pulling in behind center, it also turns the wheel left.  This happens on and off as the surface under the bike changes.  Increasing trail increases the length of the "force arm" on which that effect acts, so a bike with more trail may actually seem "nervous" or "twitchy" in sand and such as forces act off center of the tire as you travel forward.



  • counteru

    TT Member

86 posts
Location: Tennessee

Posted April 09, 2016 - 12:44 PM


thanks for the in-depth explanation! I really wanted to understand because I too just picked up a 2016 last week and haven't even gotten to ride it yet. So, I was curious as to the change and why. Thanks again.



  • Edge316

    TT Silver Member

503 posts
Location: California

Posted April 09, 2016 - 02:30 PM


I appreciate Grayracer513's explanation on offset changes but basically it comes down to what your looking for on the 16 yz450f. I would definitely suggest getting your suspension dialed in before you make offset chages. Now I've talked to a few guys that also owned 14 and 15 yz450fs and now own the 16 that think the 25mm offset is fine. I've also talked to other people such as Doug Dubach-DRD that prefer the 22mm offset. Doug told me he ran a 20 mm on the 14 and 15 yz450f but prefers the 22mm on the 16. Enzo Racing was telling me some guys are fine with 25mm but some guys have been changing to the 22mm. My biggest complaint on my 16 yz450f is the loose feeling on the entrance and exit of flat sweeping corners. Most everywhere else on the track the bikes working great. Now would the 22mm triple clamp work....maybe? Lucky for me I have a 16 yz250f and 12 yz250f I can pull the triple clamps off of. I'll let you guys know in the next week or two how it works.

  • Edge316

    TT Silver Member

503 posts
Location: California

Posted April 09, 2016 - 02:45 PM


Let me give you an example of what I'd like to correct or dont like about the 16 yz450f. Last weekend we took our 16 yz450f, our 16 yz250f , and our 12 yz250f down to Pala Raceway. I hadn't ridden the 12 yz250f in a long time. The 12 felt way more planted than either 16 yz. I could come in to the flat corner/sweeper on the 12 and put the bike wherever I wanted it and it stuck. On my 16 yz450f I struggled all day. If anyone has any other ideas on how to improve it besides the 22mm triple clamp please respond.

Edited by Edge316, April 09, 2016 - 03:16 PM.


  • blbills

    TT Bronze Member

108 posts
Location: Utah
Garage View Garage

Posted April 09, 2016 - 07:01 PM


Let me give you an example of what I'd like to correct or dont like about the 16 yz450f. Last weekend we took our 16 yz450f, our 16 yz250f , and our 12 yz250f down to Pala Raceway. I hadn't ridden the 12 yz250f in a long time. The 12 felt way more planted than either 16 yz. I could come in to the flat corner/sweeper on the 12 and put the bike wherever I wanted it and it stuck. On my 16 yz450f I struggled all day. If anyone has any other ideas on how to improve it besides the 22mm triple clamp please respond.

 

I'd really like you to try your experiment and swap triples between the 12 and the 16.  Then go back out to the track with both bikes and report back!



  • counteru

    TT Member

86 posts
Location: Tennessee

Posted April 09, 2016 - 07:11 PM


so the only issue is the flat corners and sweepers, but rutted turns it stays planted fine? I never really noticed an issue on my 14 with anything other than the front felt like it wanted to wash out easy. I won't get to ride the 16 till next weekend! SUCKS!  :cry:



  • Edge316

    TT Silver Member

503 posts
Location: California

Posted April 09, 2016 - 09:26 PM


so the only issue is the flat corners and sweepers, but rutted turns it stays planted fine? I never really noticed an issue on my 14 with anything other than the front felt like it wanted to wash out easy. I won't get to ride the 16 till next weekend! SUCKS!  :cry:

Yea flat corners and sweepers are where I'm struggling on my 16 yz450f. I've replaced the front tire which helped slightly and then had the suspension revalved by Enzo. They installed a 2.5mm spacer in the shock which lowered the rear about 7mm. They said the lowered shock would help in ruts and turns. It seemed to improve the bike, sticks great in ruts, bermed turns are no problem, I just wish it would stick better at the entrance of the flat corners/ sweepers.



  • CSAR FE

    TT Bronze Member

124 posts
Location: New Mexico
Garage View Garage

Posted April 10, 2016 - 01:45 PM


I had the bike resprung last week for my weight and set the sag at 106mm. Today when I rode it for the first time, all the cornering issues went away. It made a huge difference. With the stock 5.6 spring, I think the bike was squatting too much when rolling on the throttle exiting corners, which probably was why the front end didn't want to stick and would hop out of ruts. With the 6.3kg spring (I weigh 215 w/out gear) it stopped doing that.

Needless to say, I won't be putting new clamps on the bike anymore as it turns just fine with the suspension set up properly.

  • grayracer513
42,876 posts
Location: California
Garage View Garage

Posted April 10, 2016 - 03:41 PM


... it turns just fine with the suspension set up properly.

 

People do say that. 







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