YZ450FX IS ON IT'S WAY

Yamaha YZ450F

214 replies to this topic
  • stevethe

Posted August 01, 2015 - 03:05 PM


I've heard and seen nothing but good things with the Christini bikes. But I've never rode one.
ON PAPER there the coolest thing out there.
My CR500AF with a IRC 140 MB5 rear tire tractors and hooks up WAY better in low traction situations than my WR does.
If 2 strokes are difficult to ride in low traction situations, then why do they power most trials bikes?


Too bad you are in New York. We've got a few trails out this way for two strokes.

I use to own a CR500. It did almost anything. But certainly does not hook up better than my WR450. That's why I got rid of the CR500 and kept the WR.
Sounds like you need to put a new 140 M5B on the WR. Also might depend on what year WR you own.

  • adam500

Posted August 02, 2015 - 08:37 AM


What style 500 did you have?

Steel or aluminium frame?

Mines in a 98CR250 frame which everyone seems to hate. It is VERY rigid, feels like your riding a saw horse. I had Factory Con. respring it and it's WAY better. It has the best "point and shoot" feel of any bike I've ever ridden. Turns on a dime.

My 03 WR does NOT, but it has stock boingers. Its feels WAY more tall and top heavy and pushes the front end way more.

I think a lot of my problem with the WR is all of a sudden having a ton of engine brake when coming into a corner.

2 strokes don't do that and I like it. But thats what I'm used to. My 03 is my first 4 stroke.



  • stevethe

Posted August 02, 2015 - 11:17 AM


What style 500 did you have?
Steel or aluminium frame?
Mines in a 98CR250 frame which everyone seems to hate. It is VERY rigid, feels like your riding a saw horse. I had Factory Con. respring it and it's WAY better. It has the best "point and shoot" feel of any bike I've ever ridden. Turns on a dime.
My 03 WR does NOT, but it has stock boingers. Its feels WAY more tall and top heavy and pushes the front end way more.
I think a lot of my problem with the WR is all of a sudden having a ton of engine brake when coming into a corner.
2 strokes don't do that and I like it. But thats what I'm used to. My 03 is my first 4 stroke.


I had a 89 CR500 so steel frame. Suspension was done by racetech.

I have ridden a Sevice Honda 500 but I think the pipe or porting wasn't on like my CR. It almost felt like a 250 it was down on power.

I believe the 03 WR's are way different than the 07-11 WR's which is what I own.


Edited by stevethe, August 02, 2015 - 03:20 PM.


  • Krannie McKranface

Posted August 02, 2015 - 02:04 PM


I had a 89 CR500 so steel frame. Suspension was done by racetech.

I have ridden a Sevice Honda 500 but I think the pipe or porting wasn't on like my CR. It almost felt like a 250 it was down on power.

I believe the 03 are way different than the 07-11's which is what I own.

 

I had a Service Honda SHCR500AF ('03 frame). 

Hated it. Only fun going slow, then goosing it. I ported it for torque, revalved 2005 Showa suspension, Ignition mod box, etc etc..

 

I could ride twice as far twice as fast on my 450X.



  • MidlifeCrisisGuy

Posted August 03, 2015 - 05:26 AM


I rode a Husaberg FE390 yesterday.   After hearing all the hype about these bikes, I expected something special.  I was disappointed.  First off, it had no power.  Maybe I needed to rev it more ? My WR has way more power and its more responsive too.  And it didn't feel lighter either.   And the cockpit was terribly cramped.  It felt like a mini bike.  Maybe I'd like it if I rode it more ?

 

A KTM 300 rider rode my bike.  He loved my rear suspension.  Also said it was only just a little bit slower than his track bike, a KTM 450 SXF.  I take that as a huge compliment.



  • Krannie McKranface

Posted August 03, 2015 - 05:58 AM


All the KTM/Husa/Husky bikes have very soft power delivery, require a full turn of the throttle to get power, and are cramped in the cockpit.



  • MidlifeCrisisGuy

Posted August 03, 2015 - 10:40 AM


All the KTM/Husa/Husky bikes have very soft power delivery, require a full turn of the throttle to get power, and are cramped in the cockpit.

 

I was shocked at just how soft it was.  I know the bike has some power because I saw the owner do a wheelie on it, not that that proves much.  But it must take some effort.  Whereas on my WR, you twist the throttle and it snaps pretty quickly.  It's almost 2 stroke like.  I like it like that.  And I could dial it up or down using the programmer if I didn't.

 

It's funny how under rated Yamaha bikes are off road.  The YZ450F and YZ250F are at the top of the motocross heap.  And Yamaha is pretty much the only company that still builds a 250cc 2 stroke motocross bike.  The European bikes get all the attention, but anyone with some rudimentary mechanical skills can build one heck of an off road bike starting with a Yamaha.  It might be a few pounds heavier, but they seem to perform really well, they are affordable to buy and own and they are tough as nails.



  • adam500

Posted August 03, 2015 - 04:02 PM


Geez, I need to get out more.

You hated a Service Honda 500? Your the only one I know of.

But I guess It's all about what kind of riding your doing and/or what your used to.

I can definitly see being able to ride twice as long on your 450X. I can spend way more time on 03 WR because the riding experience isn't nearly as exciting as a run on the 500.

I still don't get the 2 strokes are worse in low traction situations thing. Most trials bikes are powered by 2 strokes. Where controling your rear wheel speed is the name of the game.

My Scorpa trials bike has a 250 Rotax 2 smoke engine. My rear tire only spins when I tell it to.

 

I also agree that Yamaha are very underated. Both with on and off road motorcycles.

I think there fit/finish and build quality are right on par with Honda.


Edited by adam500, August 03, 2015 - 04:08 PM.


  • Krannie McKranface

Posted August 03, 2015 - 04:18 PM


Geez, I need to get out more.

You hated a Service Honda 500? Your the only one I know of.

But I guess It's all about what kind of riding your doing and/or what your used to.

I can definitly see being able to ride twice as long on your 450X. I can spend way more time on 03 WR because the riding experience isn't nearly as exciting as a run on the 500.

I still don't get the 2 strokes are worse in low traction situations thing. Most trials bikes are powered by 2 strokes. Where controling your rear wheel speed is the name of the game.

My Scorpa trials bike has a 250 Rotax 2 smoke engine. My rear tire only spins when I tell it to.

 

I also agree that Yamaha are very underated. Both with on and off road motorcycles.

I think there fit/finish and build quality are right on par with Honda.

 

Trials bikes run 2lbs of air in the rear tire, and need traction for seconds.

There are Montessa four stroke trails bikes that do very well.

The advantage of a two stroke is power to weight, and not much else.


Edited by KRANNIE, August 03, 2015 - 04:19 PM.


  • grayracer513

Posted August 03, 2015 - 04:27 PM


Geez, I need to get out more.

 

 

 

I still don't get the 2 strokes are worse in low traction situations thing. Most trials bikes are powered by 2 strokes. Where controling your rear wheel speed is the name of the game.

My Scorpa trials bike has a 250 Rotax 2 smoke engine. My rear tire only spins when I tell it to.

 

 

 

Yes, but..

 

There is a considerable difference in the state of tune between the typical, competitive MX, or even off-road two-stroke and any real trials bike.  You know that, seeing as you have experience with a CR500.  Most of the former behave as if the throttle is either at zero or at something over 30%, instead of the smoother, far more linear behavior of almost all 4-strokes.



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  • adam500

Posted August 03, 2015 - 04:32 PM


Valid points.

But I do ride my trials bike for more than seconds at a time. It's not a nitro burning funny car.

I've always wanted to try a Montessa 4 stroke. Aren't they Honda engines?

 

Someone should tell Graham Jarvis he's doing it wrong.

https://www.youtube....8d4&app=desktop



  • cadesdad

Posted August 03, 2015 - 08:09 PM


Yes, but..

There is a considerable difference in the state of tune between the typical, competitive MX, or even off-road two-stroke and any real trials bike. You know that, seeing as you have experience with a CR500. Most of the former behave as if the throttle is either at zero or at something over 30%, instead of the smoother, far more linear behavior of almost all 4-strokes.

Actually, I think that my 85CR500 throttle went from 0 to 72% . Which would explain why I kept Maier plastics in business buying replacement rear fenders. Folded the silencer in half twice too. What a beast! I'm not so sure that my 03 yz450 wasn't even more powerful and explosive than my 85 CR. I think I was just a little heavier and much more experienced in 03. :)

  • grayracer513

Posted August 03, 2015 - 09:02 PM


I had a '94 CR500 right before I bought my '03 YZ450.  "They" said the YZ was a bad idea because the YZ was such an unrideable beast.  After I rode mine, i thought, "really?".

 

 

Valid points.

But I do ride my trials bike for more than seconds at a time.

 

Do you ride it for, like, two, two and-a-half hours at a time, like the desert races I ride?  Not sure how your statement meshes with the rest of this, but I thought I'd ask.



  • KennyMc

Posted August 03, 2015 - 09:17 PM


Two stroke traction..... :D
ImageUploadedByThumper Talk1438665449.248212.jpg

  • cadesdad

Posted August 03, 2015 - 09:44 PM


I had a '94 CR500 right before I bought my '03 YZ450. "They" said the YZ was a bad idea because the YZ was such an unrideable beast. After I rode mine, i thought, "really?".



Do you ride it for, like, two, two and-a-half hours at a time, like the desert races I ride? Not sure how your statement meshes with the rest of this, but I thought I'd ask.

My best friend also had a 94 cr 500. I was on a 93 cr250 at the time. We would switch back and forth trying to decide which bike to buy next, 250 or 500. I loved his 94. Talk about torque! He ended up buying a 96 Husaberg 501 and we have been on thumpers ever since. We also used to race desert when we lived in Nevada. Just trail ride now. (Very quickly)

  • RockerYZWR

Posted August 03, 2015 - 09:45 PM


Totally unrelated to the YZ450FX being on its way and with no intent of turning this into a two stroke/four stroke pissing match, but the notion that two strokes suck in low traction situations depends on the two stroke, how it's built, and how it's ridden. The low end power with the YZ250 anyway, is actually fairly soft and lacks the instant torque of the four stroke - that helps in low traction. As long as you can control the throttle and clutch, it is awesome in low traction conditions, especially if you tune down (or out) the hit (with quick timing, carb, and PV tweaks). Add on a FWW and Rekluse and you're somewhat unstoppable. Power to weight is just one advantage over the four stroke, along with significantly lower maintenance and rebuild costs, simplicity and ease of tuning (compared to a carb'd 4T, anyway), cooler running temperatures, about one moving engine part, and that sweet, sweet two stroke sound and smell.

  • cadesdad

Posted August 03, 2015 - 10:10 PM


Ahh yes! Love the smell of maxima premix and racing gas!!!

  • cadesdad

Posted August 03, 2015 - 10:11 PM


Very very excited about the YZ450FX arrival though!:)

  • Krannie McKranface

Posted August 04, 2015 - 05:50 AM


HERE IT IS

 



  • Krannie McKranface

Posted August 04, 2015 - 05:54 AM


Not really

That's a RSWR Yamaha '14 conversion.......







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