Baja Designs Dual Sport Kit



66 replies to this topic
  • 5spoke

Posted February 16, 2004 - 06:28 PM

#41

If I was going to DS my 450 I might think about keeping the stock reg/rectifier and running the lights off the AC side. It wouldn't be totally legal here in CA but you could probably get away with it. If a cop stops you (which I doubt would happen)just say "damn battery is dead again!" :) If I ended up replacing the regulator then I think I'd go full DC. Mixing loads on AC and DC can get a little tricky since many of the handlebar switches share common grounds with several of the functions (like the horn and the ignition kill for example).


That's how I'm setup now and have done 500miles with no problems. I have my headlight, taillight, lic. plate light and brake lt. on the AC side. TS's and horn on the DC. I figured if I needed an emergency light I could turn my flashers on. I do get the head light dimming when I hit the bake at low rpm, but when I get the LED taillight, it should solve that problem.

  • Lowedog

Posted February 16, 2004 - 08:55 PM

#42

I'm thinking B.D. sells their kits state specific. This might explain running the headlight on the DC side for some kits. When I recieved my kit it had a copy of the Washington state requirements to be street legal. Having the head light on without the motor wasn't on there. So my kit runs the headlight off the AC side everything else off the DC. I will find the installation instructions and see if there any specifics that may be usefull here.

Later,
Lowedog

  • PBDBLUE

Posted February 17, 2004 - 02:52 AM

#43

Actually to be legal in CA only the tail light has to be able to stay on without the engine running. Kind of dumb.

  • ETP

Posted February 17, 2004 - 05:34 AM

#44

I called Ricky Stator a while back and he said that the DC side was just enough to run the charging circuit and ignition. Thats why I was draining my battery with the kit hooked up to the DC side and the light on for a period of time. According to the manual it looks like there is plenty of power on the stock AC side to run 80 or 90 watts of lighting without getting into trouble or a whole DC regulated kit.
This thread has been very educational. Thanks guys.

  • gearbox

Posted February 17, 2004 - 12:49 PM

#45

N7SLC,
Does DDIALOQUE have Hi and Low beam with that setup ?????

  • N7SLC

Posted February 17, 2004 - 12:52 PM

#46

N7SLC,
Does DDIALOQUE have Hi and Low beam with that setup ?????


Yep! :)

  • gearbox

Posted February 17, 2004 - 01:16 PM

#47

Thanks man...
sounds like the way to go then!
Having Hi/Lo was a definite concern of mine.
That's great.

  • N7SLC

Posted February 17, 2004 - 01:35 PM

#48

I believe the stock bulb is an H4 which has hi/lo beam already. The socket wasn't wired for it, but that was easy to remedy...He's in it less than a C-Note. :)

  • Lowedog

Posted February 17, 2004 - 01:41 PM

#49

Quote from B.D. installation instructions.

"The WR 450 is unusual in that it has both a DC charging system and an AC lighting system. To install the DS kit without modifying the stock charging system, a headlight relay is used to to switch the headlight from high and low beams. Power for the headlight is picked up from the stock headlight connector."

Lowedog

  • N7SLC

Posted February 17, 2004 - 02:54 PM

#50

Quote from B.D. installation instructions.

"The WR 450 is unusual in that it has both a DC charging system and an AC lighting system. To install the DS kit without modifying the stock charging system, a headlight relay is used to to switch the headlight from high and low beams. Power for the headlight is picked up from the stock headlight connector."

Lowedog


Interesting... :D

Why even use a relay? :excuseme:Just route the original power wire
for the headlamp through the bar-mounted hi/lo beam switch
then back to the headlamp.

BD is making this far more complicated than it needs to be.
Most of the dual-sport add-on switches can handle the
current load...

This method works great on ddialogue's bike. :)

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  • PBDBLUE

Posted February 17, 2004 - 03:09 PM

#51

I think they use a relay so that they can use an all-in-one handlebar switch (I.E. - headlights, taillight, turn signals, horn, kill switch). Most of those switches share a common ground and 12 volt supply so it is difficult to run both AC and DC circuits with them. Hence the relay. They power the relay with DC to control the AC going to the headlight.

  • 5spoke

Posted February 17, 2004 - 03:11 PM

#52

I don't get it either. What’s up with this question? Run the existing AC to the handle bar sw. The sw has a wire for the hi and another for the lo. Connect these to the respective pins on the bulb socket and you are done. :)

  • 5spoke

Posted February 17, 2004 - 03:14 PM

#53

Quote: I think they use a relay so that they can use an all-in-one handlebar switch (I.E. - headlights, taillight, turn signals, horn, kill switch). Most of those switches share a common ground and 12 volt supply so it is difficult to run both AC and DC circuits with them. Hence the relay. They power the relay with DC to control the AC going to the headlight.

I agree with you on their reasoning. IMO they should use a better handle bar sw with a seperate input for the lights. It's rediculous to have extra components on the bike. Relays and crap are looking for trouble and chew juice.

  • N7SLC

Posted February 17, 2004 - 03:33 PM

#54

I think they use a relay so that they can use an all-in-one handlebar switch (I.E. - headlights, taillight, turn signals, horn, kill switch). Most of those switches share a common ground and 12 volt supply so it is difficult to run both AC and DC circuits with them. Hence the relay. They power the relay with DC to control the AC going to the headlight.


Ok, that's makes sense. But, if you're using the existing
AC wire through the switch to light the headlamp, you'll
not be using the common of the headlamp switch.
Therefore, all of your DC equipment like horn and t/signals
could use that common/ground wire and you can still
by-pass the need for a relay.

  • 5spoke

Posted February 17, 2004 - 03:45 PM

#55

I think what he ment was that there is a common DC positive on the sw to run all the lights and therefore the dc hi/lo outputs control the relay, which controls the ac to the headlight. Correct me if I'm wrong PBD.

  • PBDBLUE

Posted February 17, 2004 - 03:47 PM

#56

Exactly. The internal wiring of these switches combines a single source of DC , positive and ground, to the various switch functions. You've got to remember that what we're trying to do here with AC and DC combined is not the normal MC setup. The switches are made for the typical setup where the entire bike is run off of DC. In reality adding 1 relay really isn't that big of a deal to get the convenience of an all-in-one switch and is really a pretty simple solution.

  • N7SLC

Posted February 17, 2004 - 03:49 PM

#57

Yes, a common positive lead would definitely require a relay...

Here's the Dual-Star switch color code:

Orange - Common for turn signal switch
Black/White - LH turn signal switch
White/Blue - RH turn signal switch

Yellow/Green - Common for Horn and Kill buttons (ground)
Green/Blue - Kill button
Gray - Horn button

Violet & Brown (tied together at switch) - Common for headlight switch
White - Low beam switch
Blue - High beam switch
Yellow - Running light switch to turn lights on when headlamp is on
Pink - Running light switch to turn lights on when headlight is off (note: Yellow and Pink wires are tied together.
The only off position for the running lights is the yellow dot position on the slide switch)

Looking at the above diagram, you could run positive DC on
the Orange wire and the headlamp AC on the Voilet/Brown
wires.

Power for the t/signals and horn would be seperate from the
headlamp.

  • 5spoke

Posted February 17, 2004 - 03:59 PM

#58

I agree. My point is that there are sw's out there that have different inputs for the diff. controls, like the one I have on my bike. Why don't they just use one like that? It makes wiring alot easier as well. It simplifies the whole circuit as you can use the switches harness to make all your connections and keeps it neat and simple.

I'm going back to one of my origional statements that I believe they didn't design the kit for the WR. I believe it's their standard kit that they sell to the WR guys without changing it to suit the WR.

  • PBDBLUE

Posted February 17, 2004 - 04:01 PM

#59

I think you're right. As far as I know they use the same switch in all their kits.

  • gearbox

Posted February 19, 2004 - 04:54 AM

#60

Yep,
I think you guys may be right.
It appears that it's the Baja switch which causes the difficulty.
It does use a shared common meaning AC can't be used with DC.
5spoke I will use the handlebar switch that you have (and your advice). It keeps everything separate. N7SLC your latest posts suddenly made everything become clear.
I am sending back the Baja Kit and ordering separte parts.
I will still need your help though if you guys are not sick of this yet. When I am finished I will provide a wiring diagram with directions for anyone interested.
Thanks for all the help guys. I am no expert when it comes to electrical so this was quite educational.
Once again, I am amazed at the commradery that I find when I log on to this site. :)




 
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