YZ 450 2014 LOOSE FRONT END

Yamaha YZ450F 2014 Suspension

141 replies to this topic
  • yzUSMCf

Posted September 11, 2014 - 10:48 AM

#61

. I snuck out for 20 min on my Yz moving the bar mounts up to the top holes works great keeps me up in the center of the bike I tried it in the sand bam works just like my 13 did gotta love it one inch different for the better for me


  • CZRoger

Posted September 11, 2014 - 10:58 AM

#62

I ran mine in the front wholes on the clamps for quite awhile. Now I prefer rear mounted with the clamps rotated forward. Couldn't get back far enough on the bike at certain times.



  • YzCas

Posted September 11, 2014 - 11:10 AM

#63

I ran mine in the front wholes on the clamps for quite awhile. Now I prefer rear mounted with the clamps rotated forward. Couldn't get back far enough on the bike at certain times.

. How much difference in plays meant of the bars forward or backwards did you get?

  • CZRoger

Posted September 11, 2014 - 12:19 PM

#64

Not sure what 'plays' is in reference to your question, but there is about a 5mm or so offset in the bar mounts if I remember correctly.



  • grayracer513

Posted September 11, 2014 - 01:43 PM

#65

"plays meant" = placement (just a guess)



  • Envisage

Posted September 19, 2014 - 02:18 AM

#66

Can anyone advise, (those in the know), if lowering the fork oil level in the forks, actually makes the forks sit lower in the stroke ?

 

YZ 450 2014 model



  • grayracer513

Posted September 19, 2014 - 06:31 AM

#67

Yes it would, but only slightly. The oil level in the outer chamber determines the volume of air held captive in the fork, and that air gets compressed as the fork compresses, becoming a part of the total spring force in the fork.  Lowering the oil level reduces the effective spring rate of the air volume (lowers the compression ratio, you might say). The effect is usually more noticeable in the overall plushness/harshness of the fork than in a change in ride height.



  • Envisage

Posted September 19, 2014 - 10:06 PM

#68

Yes it would, but only slightly. The oil level in the outer chamber determines the volume of air held captive in the fork, and that air gets compressed as the fork compresses, becoming a part of the total spring force in the fork.  Lowering the oil level reduces the effective spring rate of the air volume (lowers the compression ratio, you might say). The effect is usually more noticeable in the overall plushness/harshness of the fork than in a change in ride height.

Ive already taken out 10-15ml & it felt better. I might try the same again. What im trying to do is get the fork plusher over the entire stroke really, which sounds like doing this will. Adversely im trying to get it to sit up higher in the stroke as it corners a lot better & the 1st part of the stroke is usually plushest where you want it operating more often than not. Whats the difference between this, & softening the compression ? Always a trade off isnt there !



  • MXKyle

Posted September 22, 2014 - 03:54 AM

#69

Ive already taken out 10-15ml & it felt better. I might try the same again. What im trying to do is get the fork plusher over the entire stroke really, which sounds like doing this will. Adversely im trying to get it to sit up higher in the stroke as it corners a lot better & the 1st part of the stroke is usually plushest where you want it operating more often than not. Whats the difference between this, & softening the compression ? Always a trade off isnt there !

 

Did you ever say how much you weigh?  If so I didn't see it. 

 

The bikes seem to be set up for heavier riders that in the past and if you weigh less than 190 LBS you may need to move to softer springs.  I am currently 185 so I went to the next softer fork springs  and added 10cc of oil.  The front end is much plusher and still never bottoms. 

 

As far as I'm concerned I have my bike tuned perfectly without revalving but I did need to change springs to get perfection.

 

--KT--



  • Envisage

Posted September 26, 2014 - 06:10 PM

#70

Im about 87kg & run the standard .49 in the front, & 5.9 in the rear.

 

Be interested in hearing from anyone whos tried/running the 22mm offset triple clamps ? (20 is standard), i read on the MXA DR D review of the YZ 450 2014 model that they thought these made an improvement in the way it cornered. Would certainly add straight line stability & stop it tucking in the corners

 

Also does anyone know what the standard comp & rebound clicker settings are from the factory ?



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  • grayracer513

Posted September 27, 2014 - 09:33 AM

#71


Be interested in hearing from anyone whos tried/running the 22mm offset triple clamps ? (20 is standard), i read on the MXA DR D review of the YZ 450 2014 model that they thought these made an improvement in the way it cornered. Would certainly add straight line stability & stop it tucking in the corners

 

Also does anyone know what the standard comp & rebound clicker settings are from the factory ?

 

The standard settings will be listed in the manual in section 2.

 

Are you sure about the OEM offset? 20 sounds a little extreme, but of course, axle lug offset plays into it, too.  25mm was the standard YZ offset from '98 through the '09 model, and they went to 22 with the '10.  Unless they shifted to 20 for the '14, it should still be 22. 

 

Also, going from 20 to 22 would reduce trail, so I don't think it would have the effects you're ascribing to it, quite exactly.



  • Envisage

Posted September 27, 2014 - 05:17 PM

#72

The standard settings will be listed in the manual in section 2.

 

Are you sure about the OEM offset? 20 sounds a little extreme, but of course, axle lug offset plays into it, too.  25mm was the standard YZ offset from '98 through the '09 model, and they went to 22 with the '10.  Unless they shifted to 20 for the '14, it should still be 22. 

 

Also, going from 20 to 22 would reduce trail, so I don't think it would have the effects you're ascribing to it, quite exactly.

Sry, 22 is standard. They where testing the "20mm" offset clamps which would increase trail/stability.

 

The MXA review  http://motocrossacti...t-yz450f-clamps

 

Anyone got any for sale ? for the life of me dont know why ride engineering dont make them with 2 bar mounting positions, ( like standard ?),... drill 2 extra holes which would make them lighter too, ludicrous !! Anyone know who makes rubber bar mount triple clamps with this & with 20mm offset ?

 

By alxe lug you referring to the position of the axle in the adjusters ?



  • grayracer513

Posted September 27, 2014 - 06:53 PM

#73

No, I'm referring to the amount the front axle is held offset forward of the fork tube.  Honda changed that offset a couple of times between '02 and '06. 

 

The chassis geometric that changes with clamp offset is trail.  Trail is the measurement from the contact point of the front tire to the point on the ground where a line drawn through the steering head would touch.  It's the distant by which the contact point "trails" the steering axis.  Both the forward offset of the triple clamp, and the forward offset of the front axle move those two points closer together.



  • Envisage

Posted October 03, 2014 - 05:46 PM

#74

OK, cheers !

 

My forks i find still harsh generally, (more the last part of the stroke) especially on square edge choppy stuff, giving me no confidence to push harder. I tried taking another 10mm of oil out of the forks last practice & it did make the whole stroke more plush. Thats around 20mm less than the standard oil measurement im running now trying to get the whole stroke more plush. Trouble is now i can see it is sitting lower in the stroke which is the opposite of what im trying to achieve. Given i ride really rough gnarly sand tracks im trying to keep the front end up as you do. Realize i can run less sag & lower the back which i am. Anyone have any idea's on how to try & keep the fork up & in the plush part of the stroke. Im running the standard 49'springs. Wondering if maybe going to .50's will keep the front up, (which may be to harsh) but then running less comp & oil to compensate for the heavier spring rate ? Someone even suggested you can run like plastic, or aluminum spacers under the springs to keep the front up ?, as a way of keeping the front up without adding more oil & comp ? Not sure if anyone has done/tried this.

 

YZ 450 2014 Model



  • Phil Hannah

Posted October 05, 2014 - 05:16 AM

#75

20cc is a lot of oil! To get fork to stay up more you can back rebound out. A o-ring on fork tube probably wouldn't be a bad idea. Like mentioned earlier spring change might be needed.



  • JS264

Posted October 05, 2014 - 04:45 PM

#76

How far out are you running the comp clickers?



  • tranqwhl

Posted October 05, 2014 - 06:25 PM

#77

One thing to try... can you remove a link from your chain and still be within adjustment?

 

I chased a front-end push in my 2009 YZ250F literally for years.  It wasn't bad; it was well-balanced, both ends would go at about the same time.

 

I revalved, tried new tires, got 22mm triple clamps, lowered the forks internally, messed with compression and rebound, got crazy with geometry, and still; a front-end push existed.

 

Got lower bars, tried to lean forward, yeah kinda worked, but not always.

 

Took a link out of my chain, so I had a shorter wheelbase... front end magic.

 

Maybe it's a combination of things, but if you're running your chain longer, maybe try it shorter.

 



  • Envisage

Posted October 07, 2014 - 04:16 AM

#78

How far out are you running the comp clickers?

From all way in & back out - 4 comp, & 8 reb, (this is aft last oil removal) with standard oil level was running about 8 comp



  • Envisage

Posted October 07, 2014 - 04:19 AM

#79

20cc is a lot of oil! To get fork to stay up more you can back rebound out. A o-ring on fork tube probably wouldn't be a bad idea. Like mentioned earlier spring change might be needed.

Not sure id want to speed up the rebound as a band aid to keep the front up.

 

An O ring, on the outside ?, never heard of anyone doing that ?



  • Envisage

Posted October 07, 2014 - 04:24 AM

#80

One thing to try... can you remove a link from your chain and still be within adjustment?

 

I chased a front-end push in my 2009 YZ250F literally for years.  It wasn't bad; it was well-balanced, both ends would go at about the same time.

 

I revalved, tried new tires, got 22mm triple clamps, lowered the forks internally, messed with compression and rebound, got crazy with geometry, and still; a front-end push existed.

 

Got lower bars, tried to lean forward, yeah kinda worked, but not always.

 

Took a link out of my chain, so I had a shorter wheelbase... front end magic.

 

Maybe it's a combination of things, but if you're running your chain longer, maybe try it shorter.

Mmmm, interesting, never heard of that to alleviate front end looseness.







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