Valve Adjustment...Help Please


16 replies to this topic
  • Snow Drift

Posted December 28, 2013 - 06:37 AM

#1

I have a 2007 WR450 with about 425 miles since new. I thought that I would check the valves and have found that they are out of spec so will need adjustment.

 

However, when I align the rotor mark with the mark on the casing through the inspection hole the punch marks on the camshafts to not align with the cylinder head surface. The punch marks on the camshafts look as if they are level with a spirit level and not the surface of the cylinder.

 

When I turn the crank so that the camshaft marks are level with the cylinder the mark on the rotor is about 4mm past the mark it should be aligned with. I have taken a picture of the camshaft marks showing how they are out but I don't know how to upload the photo (can anyone help).

 

It is very unlikely that anyone has dismantled the engine or even adjusted the valves given the low mileage and the way the bike was when I found it. Is it possible that something is wrong or is what I am describing normal. The bike was not running too great but not running that badly either.

 

Any thoughts or advice would be greately appreciated as I'm not sure what to do now.



  • grayracer513

Posted December 28, 2013 - 09:43 AM

#2

There are 3 marks on the flywheel rotor.  Using a clock face as a reference, the marks at 11:57 and 11:58 are connected by a horizontal mark, making it the "H" mark.  That is for ignition timing.  The third mark for TDC is at 12:00, and is used for timing the cams.  You can verify the TDC mark by using a probe down the spark plug hole and comparing it with true top dead center.

 

It is not uncommon that the cam timing marks do not precisely align with the head surface.  The thing to do is to imagine the mark being on the tooth next to where it is and see if that would be closer or farther from lining.



  • Snow Drift

Posted December 28, 2013 - 12:36 PM

#3

Thanks very much. For some reason I didn't see all three of the marks. Now that I'm going by the right mark the cam marks are almost in line with the cylinder head. It would be to far out if the cams were rotated one tooth on the chain, I'm guessing that means that it would also be too far out if the sprocket on the crank by the rotor was rotated one tooth on the chain?



  • Snow Drift

Posted December 28, 2013 - 12:48 PM

#4

Do you know if the ProX shims are good or should I try and stick to genuine Yamaha. It seems that here in the UK these are my only two choices.


Edited by Snow Drift, December 28, 2013 - 12:49 PM.


  • foggy3061

Posted December 28, 2013 - 01:23 PM

#5

I've only ever used genuine yamaha or hotcams shims, as per these kits:

http://www.racespec...._Shim_Kits.html

The cheapest way to do it is to measure your clearances (and note down), then remove each shim at a time and see which shim is fitted on each valve (make a note of once again). Then look in your yamaha workshop manual and use the shimming table to find out which replacement shims you need, then order just those ypu need.

You may be lucky, as occasionally shims removed from one valve may fit the requirement for another valve's adjustment, meaning you may not need to order five new shims.

  • KennyMc

Posted December 29, 2013 - 01:20 PM

#6

Are you sure you are checking the valves correctly?  425 miles since new or 425 miles since you got it?  The exhaust cam could be rotated 1 tooth as to give it "YZ timing" but then the e-start shouldn't be working all that well.

 

I ask about the mileage because I have an '07 and just this past May did a valve job on it for the first time ever.  I never even checked the valves until then and my motor guy said they were still within spec when he got in there.  I had them all replaced anyway and went with the YZ timed Hotcams made for the WR which allows for the use of the e-start still since the decomp pin is adjusted.



  • Dakar Dan

Posted December 29, 2013 - 04:15 PM

#7

Make sure that the cam cover gasket is off the head (the one with the two half-moon shapes). It should come off with the magnesium cover. First time I did the valves myself I couldn't understand why I couldn't get the two punch marks on the cam to align: the surface of the actual head is a couple of mm lower than the top of the gasket if it sticks on there. It's all so much easier the second (and third, and fourth...) time you check & adjust the valves.



  • GuyGraham

Posted December 30, 2013 - 07:14 AM

#8

I have a 2007 WR450 with about 425 miles since new. I thought that I would check the valves and have found that they are out of spec so will need adjustment.

 

However, when I align the rotor mark with the mark on the casing through the inspection hole the punch marks on the camshafts to not align with the cylinder head surface. The punch marks on the camshafts look as if they are level with a spirit level and not the surface of the cylinder.

 

When I turn the crank so that the camshaft marks are level with the cylinder the mark on the rotor is about 4mm past the mark it should be aligned with. I have taken a picture of the camshaft marks showing how they are out but I don't know how to upload the photo (can anyone help).

 

It is very unlikely that anyone has dismantled the engine or even adjusted the valves given the low mileage and the way the bike was when I found it. Is it possible that something is wrong or is what I am describing normal. The bike was not running too great but not running that badly either.

 

Any thoughts or advice would be greately appreciated as I'm not sure what to do now.

 

When you say out of spec what exactly are the valve clearances you have measured?

The WR valve train is very robust and known to go well over 10K miles without need for adjustment so an adjust at 425miles is very unusual

 

Normally the gap closes up, which actually increase valve lift so makes the engine run stronger

Bad thing about this is that once the valve clearance is zero, the valve can't loose its heat as it seat in the head and so overheats and burns out

The bike is also very hard to start from cold with zero valve clearances

 

To host a picture, either attach it via the img button in the toolbar above the box you type in, or host it on a third party photo site like photobucket and post the html link into you post and the image will be displayed

 

 

 

Do you know if the ProX shims are good or should I try and stick to genuine Yamaha. It seems that here in the UK these are my only two choices.

 

Any 9.48 dia shim will fit

Hotcams, Yamaha, Suzuki, Honda etc

 

Most dealers will do a swap for a nominal fee - Find your nearest road bike main dealer and pop and see them.

My local road bike dealer swaps them for a couple of quid

 

examples of some prices

OE Suzuki shims are £4.29 ea (12892-41C00-230 - this is the part number for a 2.30 shim, as indicated on last 3 digits - just changes these last three digits fro correct size you want and you have the part number)

eBay - http://www.ebay.co.u...=item2c7856d261

eBay (Hotcams at £1.75 ea) - http://www.ebay.co.u...=item3389210740

eBay (Hotcams at £2.64 ea) - http://www.ebay.co.u...=item3ccbb7d345

 

Yamaha shims seems a bit pricey at £8 ea!!!


Edited by GuyGraham, December 30, 2013 - 07:28 AM.


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  • Snow Drift

Posted December 30, 2013 - 08:53 AM

#9

Although I have no absolute proof the bike has done 425 miles this is what the digital speedo says, and it doesn't seem to reset when you disconnect the battery. Also it was one owner using it and wasn't used on the road.

 

The gasket is off when trying to align the marks. It is almost there and I'm probably being a bit padantic. I was just concerned that someone may have turned the cams or that it has somehow jumped.

 

The valve clearances are 0.06, 0.10, 0.09 on the intake valves going left to right when sitting on the bike and 0.18, 0.18 for the exhaust valves.

 

I ordered the Yamaha shims today before reading this post.



  • Snow Drift

Posted December 30, 2013 - 01:47 PM

#10

Should I be using threadlocker on the cam cover bolts. I don't think the manual requires it but I just wondered if it was a good idea?



  • GuyGraham

Posted December 31, 2013 - 01:52 AM

#11

Marks rarely line up exactly, and cam chain wear aonly makes it worse

As long as they are the closest you can get to being in line (ie if you advance or retard the cam by one tooth either way and it is worse) you should be good to go

try and post a pic if you can

 

No thread locker required on camshaft cap bolts - just use a good torque wrench and tighten to the correct spec (10Nm)

Over tightened and you risk stripping a thread or affecting the camshaft journal running clearance (bad), under tightened and you risk it coming loose (equally bad) - don't try and guess it, get a torque wrench and do it properly

I've never had any problems just tightening camshaft caps to the correct torque and not using thread locker


Edited by GuyGraham, December 31, 2013 - 01:56 AM.


  • grayracer513

Posted December 31, 2013 - 07:49 AM

#12

You need to differentiate between "cam caps" that hold the cams onto the head and the "cam cover" that sits over them, and is what the question stated.  No thread locker is required for the cam cover.  No thread locker is allowed on the cam cap bolts, which the manual specifies are to be oiled on installation.

 

Pay critical attention to the correct seating of the caps BEFORE they are are tightened, to the torque sequence, and the torque limit.



  • funt

Posted June 12, 2014 - 05:48 AM

#13

I didn't have a giant hex key to take out the timing plug.  I stuck the head of a bolt in there, 9/16 I think it was, and jammed two nuts on it and got it out that way.  That sucker was torqued down pretty good.



  • DAVE63

Posted June 13, 2014 - 02:01 AM

#14

I have a later model wr 450 and the end of the spark plug tool fit my timing plug < 14mm>



  • bobpara

Posted June 13, 2014 - 05:00 AM

#15

I was going to say the same thing.....425 miles!! ?? These engines have a reputation for lasting 1000 hours or more !!

 

Sounds like your valves are just barely out of spec, not including the .06 mm one on the intake

 

Also sounds like you caught it WAY early so there is no damage at all

 

but why not, get them all set on the high side of the spec and I bet you'll never need to adjust again



  • bobpara

Posted June 13, 2014 - 05:02 AM

#16

425 miles.....that bike should look like brand new off the showroom floor minus maybe a couple of scratches

I have an '06 and it has two trip odometers but it does not have a total cumulative mileage odo



  • funt

Posted June 13, 2014 - 12:40 PM

#17

I have a later model wr 450 and the end of the spark plug tool fit my timing plug < 14mm>

Now why didn't I think of that?






 
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