New '11 WR450 or '12WR450

Yamaha WR450F 2011 Yamaha WR450F 2012

76 replies to this topic
  • funt

Posted November 05, 2013 - 02:06 PM

#41

I was having trouble with the button on my '12.  Someone posted to give the button a quick bump, wait for it to prime, start it.  Works every time for me.



  • 080

Posted November 05, 2013 - 02:46 PM

#42

What exactly is the shop doing to "re-tune" the WR?  Being that about the only tuneable feature that the older models don't have is the FI.  If these guys were that picky and spent money on a new bike, they can buy the GYTR programmer and try different maps on their own. 

     

 

 

 

Programmer won't adjust the fuel mix at idle/start up. If you read the post per the TT feedback it looks like some dealerships know how to do it and some don't.

http://www.thumperta...-starting-woes/



  • 080

Posted November 05, 2013 - 02:51 PM

#43

I was having trouble with the button on my '12.  Someone posted to give the button a quick bump, wait for it to prime, start it.  Works every time for me.

 

+ 1..... I've kind of done this since day one just because it seemed like the pump needed to cycle first. I do the same thing before kicking it over and have not experienced the issue's others are having.



  • 080

Posted November 05, 2013 - 03:07 PM

#44

I have two rider from Baja,3 from CA all 12-13.Yes they have done all the mods,Still not right for the type riding we do.

 

Not trying to step in the middle of this but is it just the starting issue that the guy's you ride with are not liking or other traits the bike has?



  • mch

Posted November 05, 2013 - 03:26 PM

#45

Programmer won't adjust the fuel mix at idle/start up. If you read the post per the TT feedback it looks like some dealerships know how to do it and some don't.

http://www.thumperta...-starting-woes/

 

Yeah, I ordered mine a week or two ago (still waiting for it - and could do without it).  I still don't think that's something these guys doing Baja tours are going back to the shop on multiple occasions for "tuning" related work.  The guy was saying the 12 & 13's aren't good in baja, so I really doubt he was referring to starting issues. 



  • JDLowrance

Posted November 05, 2013 - 06:27 PM

#46

Good thing I don't ride Baja then.....



  • stevethe

Posted November 05, 2013 - 07:15 PM

#47

Will Olivia Newton John be standing at the start in skin tight pants?

Please please please one of you So Cal boys make sure and video this.

Also, what will it mean if some slappy on a clapped out 10 year old 125 2 stroke beats both the Carbed Mexican Super WR and the JD 12 FI WR up this Jawbone hill??????

 

 

Olivia Newton who !

But in all fairnes whats a 125 2 stroke. You mean like a Bultaco pursang or a kawasuki 125

And the question is will any of bikes even make the hill !



  • 080

Posted November 05, 2013 - 07:22 PM

#48

Yeah, I ordered mine a week or two ago (still waiting for it - and could do without it).  I still don't think that's something these guys doing Baja tours are going back to the shop on multiple occasions for "tuning" related work.  The guy was saying the 12 & 13's aren't good in baja, so I really doubt he was referring to starting issues. 

 

Kind of what I was thinking, for Baja/fire road stuff I would prefer the longer wheel base, bigger frame geometry of the 11' myself. The newer WR's are definitely more geared for the woods/singletrack/hair scramble type guy.



  • Bandit9

Posted November 05, 2013 - 07:50 PM

#49

Kind of what I was thinking, for Baja/fire road stuff I would prefer the longer wheel base, bigger frame geometry of the 11' myself. The newer WR's are definitely more geared for the woods/singletrack/hair scramble type guy.


I would agree with that.

  • MidlifeCrisisGuy

Posted November 05, 2013 - 08:42 PM

#50

Kind of what I was thinking, for Baja/fire road stuff I would prefer the longer wheel base, bigger frame geometry of the 11' myself. The newer WR's are definitely more geared for the woods/singletrack/hair scramble type guy.

Put on a 13 or 17mm offset triple clamp to increase the trail and have at it. The wheel base isn't that much different than the so called desert bikes. Its the geometry that is different, mostly the trail dimension.

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  • Bandit9

Posted November 05, 2013 - 09:29 PM

#51

13 or 17mm? I'm no expert at bike geometry, but isn't that a drastic change from the normal 22 to 25mm?

  • JDLowrance

Posted November 06, 2013 - 02:46 AM

#52

Stock is 25mm. Most aftermarket companies manufacture 22mm offset triples for the Yamahas which will enhance the stability by increasing the trail by same amount.

 

To be honest I've not had any issues with stability on the 2012....it turns really well and handles 4th or 5th gear whoops just fine with the stock clamps.

 

I would like a set of the Ride Engineering black ano 22mm triple clamps. They look good and would provide a little more stability but I cannot justify the $450 as the bike works so well with the stock clamps. Had to install the 18mm clamps on my KTM desert racebikes as they definitely needed the help with stability.


Edited by JDLowrance, November 06, 2013 - 02:47 AM.


  • 080

Posted November 06, 2013 - 06:14 AM

#53

The wheel base isn't that much different than the so called desert bikes. Its the geometry that is different, mostly the trail dimension.


Your right, the difference is small approx 3/4" but it makes a big difference in straight line stability. I use to lower my forks and run the rear axle as far back as I could when I was running more open desert races and stability was a huge improvement in the faster stuff. Although it was a compromise when I had to do things like "turn"......... Anyways, its amazing at how much just pushing the rear axle back makes even if nothing is done with the forks.

  • stevethe

Posted November 06, 2013 - 08:07 AM

#54

Put on a 13 or 17mm offset triple clamp to increase the trail and have at it. The wheel base isn't that much different than the so called desert bikes. Its the geometry that is different, mostly the trail dimension.

 

 

I run the13 mm on the supermoto bike and think thats what they are intended for. I use the 17 mm Zip Ty clamps on the carbed WR. Don't know if they would fit the newer version.



  • GP1K

Posted November 06, 2013 - 09:05 AM

#55

 

Just curious, but why the slow idle? I ride mostly tight PNW tight woods/single track and don't have a problem the higher idle on my WR. But that sure explains why you're having 'problems' with the 12+ WRs as they need to be around 2100 RPM idle or they're very hard to start, especially when hot, and I've experienced this myself.

 

I'm sure I'm stating the obvious here when I say bikes like the new WRs aren't XRs, they don't make power like XRs and never will, so expecting them to idle and chug and behave like an old XR just isn't realistic.



  • 080

Posted November 06, 2013 - 10:16 AM

#56

The other problems the guys had have been worked out,but they want the bikes to idle real slow like a Xr and still start.For riding the trails we do a slow idle is important.What info can I pass on?


I assuming you want a lower idle so as not to overheat as quickly in the slower stuff? I tried dogging mine down to 1700rpms but it caused it to flame out to easily but seems to be fine at 1900rpms. I think the spec is 1900-2100rpms per the manual. I've never been able to take the idle down on the newer 4strks like I could on the old XR just due to the flame out thing. The bike was set 2050when I got it and to date I haven't had any issue's with overheating and that's riding through the summer here in Az. The suggestion I would say is to keep it in the rpm range the manual states and if they still have issue's take it to the dealer and have them set the idle fuel mix as the guys are doing in the post above. Seems like once this was done the starting issue's went away.

  • Baja trail Rider

Posted November 06, 2013 - 11:04 AM

#57

Thank you for Help GP.Our carb WRs do idle (XR like) with the mods we did to carbs,stock no they would not idle down.Why we like super slow idle.The single track trails we go down.More like horse trails,with drop offs ,or no run out at bottom.When we go down the trails,first gear slow idle,running.For now the guys with the FI bikes,have not been able to turn idle down.They walk the bikes down trail,motor off.Or hold the clutch in,motor off,just use brakes.I know since the Fi bikes are new,there will be a fix for this.Some of the single track,or call it horse trails.Go for over a hundred miles.So its alot of work,to ride the bike this way,for such a long time.Any Idea to help this would be nice.Thank you



  • MidlifeCrisisGuy

Posted November 06, 2013 - 03:45 PM

#58

Thank you for Help GP.Our carb WRs do idle (XR like) with the mods we did to carbs,stock no they would not idle down.Why we like super slow idle.The single track trails we go down.More like horse trails,with drop offs ,or no run out at bottom.When we go down the trails,first gear slow idle,running.For now the guys with the FI bikes,have not been able to turn idle down.They walk the bikes down trail,motor off.Or hold the clutch in,motor off,just use brakes.I know since the Fi bikes are new,there will be a fix for this.Some of the single track,or call it horse trails.Go for over a hundred miles.So its alot of work,to ride the bike this way,for such a long time.Any Idea to help this would be nice.Thank you


My bike spends much of its life in very tight, steep terrain. I had to cut the bars down to 30- inches to make it between the trees. A lot of our trails are actual horse trails.

At first it was a handful because idling in 1st gear was too fast. When my experienced friend rode it, he said it wanted to attack everything at 20MPH minimum speed. You didn't notice how fast it wanted to go until you either idled it in first gear beside another bike or were in very tight conditions. Then you realized that it was trying to go too fast.

When I checked the idle speed with my GYTR tuner, I found it was idling at 2600+ RPM. I turned it down to 1900-2000. It still starts well.

I also regeared it 12-51.

It still didn't like steep downhills. I resprung the front end with 0.50 Kg springs and increased the amount of oil in the forks so they were more progressive. I also introduced a little bit of air into the rear brake circuit so that the rear brake isn't so touchy.

I also upgraded the clutch to a Magura hydraulic unit.

Its a mountain goat now. It will torque its way up nearly anything and downhills are much, much better. And if you flame it out, its much, much easier to restart than the XRs I rode.

I bet with some tinkering you could get it to idle really slow. I'll play with the idle when I get my FI tuner.

Edited by MidlifeCrisisGuy, November 06, 2013 - 03:47 PM.


  • vlxjim

Posted November 06, 2013 - 04:06 PM

#59

Now that we can tune our bikes with the FI diagnostic tool. This is not the same as the GYTR Power Programer. (You should own both if you own the newer FI bikes.) Now that I have my idle richened I could probably turn my idle down. The mystery for these FI bikes is gone. We can now tune the idle circuits and adjusts the fuel and timing maps with easy. We are now in full control of the fuel injection and the starting problem is nonexistent if you do it right. When done right these bikes also Idle better and are a lot harder to stall out. The problem was they were still running to lean at the low end for EPA green sticker bike. Even with the comp ECU in place.



  • Bandit9

Posted November 06, 2013 - 05:10 PM

#60

My bike spends much of its life in very tight, steep terrain. I had to cut the bars down to 30- inches to make it between the trees. A lot of our trails are actual horse trails.At first it was a handful because idling in 1st gear was too fast. When my experienced friend rode it, he said it wanted to attack everything at 20MPH minimum speed. You didn't notice how fast it wanted to go until you either idled it in first gear beside another bike or were in very tight conditions. Then you realized that it was trying to go too fast.When I checked the idle speed with my GYTR tuner, I found it was idling at 2600+ RPM. I turned it down to 1900-2000. It still starts well.I also regeared it 12-51.It still didn't like steep downhills. I resprung the front end with 0.50 Kg springs and increased the amount of oil in the forks so they were more progressive. I also introduced a little bit of air into the rear brake circuit so that the rear brake isn't so touchy.I also upgraded the clutch to a Magura hydraulic unit.Its a mountain goat now. It will torque its way up nearly anything and downhills are much, much better. And if you flame it out, its much, much easier to restart than the XRs I rode.I bet with some tinkering you could get it to idle really slow. I'll play with the idle when I get my FI tuner.


You introduced air into the brake system??? WTF?

Not saying it isn't plausible, just after 13 years riding, racing, and reading forums and I have never heard of anyone purposely introducing air into a brake system to make it less touchy.

Care to explain?





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