DYNATEK FS IGNITION: Advanced settings & TPS explained


19 replies to this topic
  • Krannie McKranface

Posted September 29, 2013 - 06:19 PM

#1

Dynatek Dyna FS ignition system to replace the stock WR450F ignition system.

Works with 2003 - 2011 models

Allows you to correct the factory problems with 'map toggling' (studder), and change ignition curve maps with dip switches

Standard 'go-to' map for curing the studder is map 3, which is the mildest ignition map (nearly stock 2003 map).

Going to Map 2 (2006 YZ450F) gives you more power everywhere, but it is 'ragged' and still exposes some of the studder.

 

All supplied/loaded maps (1-4) are made up of (3) combined maps, that over lap (or toggle): closed throttle, partial throttle, and WO throttle

 

So, map 2, the radical map, has a different sub-map for the three different throttle positions, determined by the TPS.

 

Well, what if you want to have a more advanced setting, and still fix 99% of the studder?

What if you wanted the closed throttle, partial throttle and WO throttle ignition curves to work in different rpms than defualt?

What if you wanted to alter the provided map curves, to change the amount of advance, and when it occurs in each TPS map?

 

Then you need the Dyna DIPK-6 programming tool.

 

It's just a 'black box' that goes between a supplied plug on the iginiton harness, and your laptop.

 

This allows you to:

 

1. Calibrate your TPS (really calibrate it, and check it, in seconds)

2. Alter the stock maps 1 through 4

3. Alter the 'turnover points' for the partial throttle and WOT sub-maps that make up each map

4. change rev limiters

5. Advance and retard the entire map, or individual parts of the map

 

... and a bunch more cools stuff....

 

 

So, &%$#@! are you supposed to do with all of that information anyway.....

 

Do this!

 

Look at the screen shot below:

IMG_2948_zpsa686f11b.jpg

 

This is the screen you see when do basic programming, calibrate the TPS, and alter TPS turnover points.

Look at the TPS Calibration box, and you can see the TPS is already calibrated. It takes 30 seconds to do.

Look at the TPS Settings box, and you can see the turnover points are 57% open throttle for the WOT curve and 28% open throttle for the partial throttle opening curve.

Out of the box the turnover points are  are 12% and 48%.

The 12% is part of the problem.

It is position on the throttle that is very common for cruising the street, and therefore the ignition likes to jump between closed and partial throttle maps. AKA 'studder'.

 

So now, when at 12% throttle, you are below the next sub-map. At 28%, you are accelerating in almost any terrain, so you don't feel any toggling occurring.

 

( The Dyna's stock curve # 3 is 48% and 65% turnover points, putting the 'toggle' point way out of range, but also forcing a very tame map)

 

 

I also clicked the 'Advance Timing' box, to advance everything 1 additional degree (from 10 to 11 at idle, for example) using the Timing page options:

 

IMG_2947_zps235923bd.jpg

 

Now, the bike idles with more authority (advanced timing by 1 degree), the transition from closed, to partial, to wide-open throttle are no longer 'felt' like 'flat spots' in the throttle throw and rpm range (turnover points) , and the partial throttle studder is 99% gone, while still using the 'radical' map #3 (turn over points)

 

I hope this information will help anyone out there considering the Dyna FS ignition to get their bike to run smoother; and you will also have the added benefit (if you buy the programmer) to improve the overall running characteristics of the motor.

 

The bike now runs quite a bit better, much more smooth authority off idle and much less feeling of 'uh-oh' when needing power 'right now', at any rpm.

 

 

 

Part of the reason I never posted lots of technical installation and tuning details when doing the cams and porting, is because I knew the sooner or later I would have to deal with the TPS turnover issue to be able to evaluate what this motor really feels like. 

 

In fact, I believe that some of the reason that some people have great success with just bolting on the YZ or hotcams without any other modifications, is because their stock ignition is probably advanced a degree or two more than others are, either by mistake, or by bad electronics, or by chance. I have ridden stock bikes that are all identical but all have substantially different power characteristics (something I've never felt before to such an extent) and now I honestly think it's because the stock ignition is not very good, and has been shipped out with varying degrees of advance and retard, right from the factory. I think that would explain a lot.

 

I also think that just a YZ or hotcams set up and the Dyna FS and programmer would be all you need to get the bike to run amazingly smooth.......and that you don't 'need' the porting to 'fix' anything. It just wakes up the power (radically!) and makes the motor run cooler and smoother.

 

But let me be perfectly clear about this  : THIS MOTOR ROCKS with the AS Racing stage 3 port and polish added to it!  

 

It's a fire-breathing monster, and a gentle little lamb, all controlled easily with your right hand. 

 

I would invite anyone who would like substantially more power, without any compromises,  to take mine for a spin. 


Edited by Krannie, September 29, 2013 - 09:38 PM.


  • beairmo

Posted September 30, 2013 - 06:17 AM

#2

Thanks for the excellent explanation of the WR ignition maps and what the stutter really is... I really needed this.

 

Coincidently, I installed a Dynatek DFS7-23P on my 09 WR450F last Saturday. Since I DS my WR I really wanted it to run smooth at lower RPMS. Prior to this I tried everything from replacing the TPS to jetting the carb with FMF Dyno kit, with absolutely no luck.

 

In short, the Dynatek eleminated about 90 percent of the stutter. I have only ran map 4 so far, but will be doing some more testing. 

 

One question. I don't understand what they are saying in the instructions about the tethered kill switch that is grounded. My bike has the stock kill switch which connected the ECU to ground via the push button on left hand grip. Will this damage the ECU? They claim that it uses the factory connectors with no modifications, then give you multiple warnings regarding the tethered kill switch, which I assume is for ATVs.

 

After reading your explanation, I am going to order the programmer so I can calibrated the TPS and see if I can get rid of the 3000rpm map switch stutter.

 

Thanks again!



  • Krannie McKranface

Posted September 30, 2013 - 12:48 PM

#3

;0)



  • jetfuel

Posted September 30, 2013 - 03:05 PM

#4

Thanks for the write up.. very helpful ..



  • stevethe

Posted October 02, 2013 - 07:15 AM

#5

Krannie,

 

Well done. How come Dynatek didn't say that.

Now you will put me in the garage again draging down the main computer. It doesnt work with an Apple lap top.

Best of all if you mess up the factory settings, close Curvemaker and reopen. Go to configure page and click on curve 2. Hit the send curve button and the default settings will be entered back.



  • Krannie McKranface

Posted October 02, 2013 - 07:36 AM

#6

Krannie,

 

Well done. How come Dynatek didn't say that.

Now you will put me in the garage again draging down the main computer. It doesnt work with an Apple lap top.

Best of all if you mess up the factory settings, close Curvemaker and reopen. Go to configure page and click on curve 2. Hit the send curve button and the default settings will be entered back.

 

Yes.

I didn't go into the create/save/store/load details, good point.

 

I'm still having some minor trouble with the closed throttle map on Map # 3.

At 1/32 throttle (?) it still studders a bit, but so what. This is not a street bike, in Map #3 anyway. Like, too totally radical, fur shur.

It also snap/crackle/pops occasionally on this map at 1/4  throttle, which means my needle probably needs to go up a notch.

Again, it is almost never noticed in the dirt.

I am now using the 2003 WR system file as a base, as it seems more stable and consistent.

The 2006 YZ file doesn't always load or see my ignition.



  • stevethe

Posted October 02, 2013 - 08:22 AM

#7

Yes.

I didn't go into the create/save/store/load details, good point.

 

I'm still having some minor trouble with the closed throttle map on Map # 3.

At 1/32 throttle (?) it still studders a bit, but so what. This is not a street bike, in Map #3 anyway. Like, too totally radical, fur shur.

It also snap/crackle/pops occasionally on this map at 1/4  throttle, which means my needle probably needs to go up a notch.

Again, it is almost never noticed in the dirt.

I am now using the 2003 WR system file as a base, as it seems more stable and consistent.

The 2006 YZ file doesn't always load or see my ignition.

 

Very intesting I tried to set the throttle position sensor on the Dynatek and it studdered. So I went back to the stock default setting. I can only run the traction map or it will studder. However it is on a 08 street bike.

 

 

I tried a vortex on it a while back and it studdered bad. I ended up putting the vortex on the 07 dirt bike and no studders even on the street. Can't figure that one out.



  • beezer

Posted October 02, 2013 - 09:33 AM

#8

So you're saying your bike runs better now?

 

My bike didn't like the YZ map.  It seemed to run lean and phart out the exhaust when the throttle was closed.



  • grayracer513

Posted October 02, 2013 - 11:43 AM

#9

 It doesnt work with an Apple lap top.

 

You can fix that with a free copy of Sun Virtual Box and a copy of Windows XP.  Run Windows inside your Mac OS the few times that you need it. 



  • stevethe

Posted October 02, 2013 - 03:26 PM

#10

So you're saying your bike runs better now?

 

My bike didn't like the YZ map.  It seemed to run lean and phart out the exhaust when the throttle was closed.

yep I'm using the Dynatek without any studder for the street.

Using the Vortex on the dirt wr with no studdering on map 1 then switchable to a torque map on the fly.

 

You can fix that with a free copy of Sun Virtual Box and a copy of Windows XP.  Run Windows inside your Mac OS the few times that you need it. 

Nice to know thanks.



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  • Parx_400

Posted October 09, 2013 - 03:50 PM

#11

You Sir are awesome for explaining this. 

 

Can you change maps with the bike Running? Also can you change map #4, the default one. Here is what im thinking of doing. 

 

If the answer is yes to both, I want to use a bar mounted switch using a button from Hyway dirt bikes. I only need to two maps, a DS on and an aggressive off road one. 

 

The current switch has three wires and 4 settings. If the switch is not hooked up the CDI defaults to #4. So when the switch is on #4 there is no connection going on. The three wires 1-2, 1-3, and 2-3 give you the other 3 setting. I would need to know the Pin out. Then I could use an on off switch from Hyway dirt bike and have map 4 be DS mode(off) and one other map be off road (On). 



  • Krannie McKranface

Posted October 09, 2013 - 06:52 PM

#12

You cannot change maps on the fly.

The igntion must be cycled on/off when you change dip positions.

 

There is no map #4 in the software.

 

There is no reason to change maps often, if you have the map set up correctly.

 

You want partial throttle to have less advance, accept at idle, so partial throttle situations are not 'hairy'. 

Remember, this is not like a KTM, where you get 2 'fixed' maps that you can choose from.

You get 3 maps made of three submaps that are throttle position sensitive.

Thats why I have mine set at 0%/30%/57%  instead of 0%/12% 46% or whatever the stock settings are.

The low advance map stays in a little longer, so 1/4 throttle and below is in the low advance setting.

Then past 1/4 throttle, it goes to the full advance up to a certain rpm where it tapers off, unless you go full throttle.

 

So when you ride my bike for the first time, it seems really tame and boring. Then I yell at you " go the half throttle at every shift" and you respond with a "holy shit!" and a  wheelie in every gear.....well, not 5th...


Edited by Krannie, October 09, 2013 - 06:54 PM.


  • stevethe

Posted October 10, 2013 - 07:01 AM

#13

Krannie is right with the Dynatek.

 

If you use the Vortex it has more maps and is switchable on the fly.  It comes with a handlebar mounted switch that has two positions.

 

If I were to compare the two, I would have to say the Dynatek removed the studder and is less expensive. The Dynatek is better on custom programming. So if it was a supermoto- street bike I would go with the Dynatek.

 

The Vortex did not remove the studder from the supermoto bike. However when mounted on a dirt WR450 that never had a studder it appears to work well. It is being run almost 100% of the time on map 1 which is the hot map bike is modified with cams, carb work, pipe, porting and other stuff.

 

If I were trying to remove the studder I would use the Dynatek. Like Krannie said once you dial it in thats about all you need.



  • beairmo

Posted November 07, 2013 - 08:43 AM

#14

Anyone want to sell or rent their Dynatek Curvemaker kit?

 

I am very happy with the Dynatek improvement in eliminating the stutter, but still need to calibrated the TPS.

 

If you have a problem with stutter on your WR and its driving you nuts, get the Dynatek. And let me know if you want to go halves on the programmer! lol



  • Krannie McKranface

Posted November 07, 2013 - 09:47 AM

#15

Anyone want to sell or rent their Dynatek Curvemaker kit?

 

I am very happy with the Dynatek improvement in eliminating the stutter, but still need to calibrated the TPS.

 

If you have a problem with stutter on your WR and its driving you nuts, get the Dynatek. And let me know if you want to go halves on the programmer! lol

 

It's only $83.00........



  • beairmo

Posted November 07, 2013 - 10:04 AM

#16

Haha Krannie... I know! LOL

 

I just have soooo many things I need to buy for my project RD350 cafe racer.



  • Krannie McKranface

Posted November 07, 2013 - 10:50 AM

#17

Haha Krannie... I know! LOL

 

I just have soooo many things I need to buy for my project RD350 cafe racer.

 

 Pfffttt....that flexy smoker will never give you the satisfaction the WR will. 

The only way to have fun on the street is to constantly be breaking the law, and risking your life.  Weee, fun....



  • beairmo

Posted November 26, 2014 - 02:38 PM

#18

You cannot change maps on the fly.

The igntion must be cycled on/off when you change dip positions.

 

There is no map #4 in the software.

 

There is no reason to change maps often, if you have the map set up correctly.

 

You want partial throttle to have less advance, accept at idle, so partial throttle situations are not 'hairy'. 

Remember, this is not like a KTM, where you get 2 'fixed' maps that you can choose from.

You get 3 maps made of three submaps that are throttle position sensitive.

Thats why I have mine set at 0%/30%/57%  instead of 0%/12% 46% or whatever the stock settings are.

The low advance map stays in a little longer, so 1/4 throttle and below is in the low advance setting.

Then past 1/4 throttle, it goes to the full advance up to a certain rpm where it tapers off, unless you go full throttle.

 

So when you ride my bike for the first time, it seems really tame and boring. Then I yell at you " go the half throttle at every shift" and you respond with a "holy shit!" and a  wheelie in every gear.....well, not 5th...

Bringing this thread back up to the top... Very good stuff here for those WR450 owners that like to geek out.

 

Krannie, do you have any updates to your map since you originally posted this? Would you be willing to share your config file? Thanks!

 

It took me a while and more than one laptop, but I finally got computer talking to the DynaFS. VERY COOL.....



  • Krannie McKranface

Posted November 26, 2014 - 03:35 PM

#19

Bringing this thread back up to the top... Very good stuff here for those WR450 owners that like to geek out.

 

Krannie, do you have any updates to your map since you originally posted this? Would you be willing to share your config file? Thanks!

 

It took me a while and more than one laptop, but I finally got computer talking to the DynaFS. VERY COOL.....

 

Yeah, I had to use a very old pc to download the updates, and my back up laptop to configure the module.

 

I don't have any files to share at the moment.

 

My motor is in pieces waiting for a crank set, trans bearings, top end, etc.

 

I will re-visit the map then.

 

Suffice to say that I used the provide #2 map, and advanced across the board 1 degree, and changed the 1st transition from 3100rpms to 4500rpms, way above the usual 'studder' point when cruising on the street....but there still is a noticeable 'rough spot' (audidble, but you can't feel it) using the #2 map.

 

The #3 map is the 'go to' map most of the time, as it is the most agressive, and has the most throttle response just above idle.


Edited by Kah Ran Nee, November 26, 2014 - 03:37 PM.


  • beairmo

Posted November 26, 2014 - 06:48 PM

#20

Yeah, I had to use a very old pc to download the updates, and my back up laptop to configure the module.

 

I don't have any files to share at the moment.

 

My motor is in pieces waiting for a crank set, trans bearings, top end, etc.

 

I will re-visit the map then.

 

Suffice to say that I used the provide #2 map, and advanced across the board 1 degree, and changed the 1st transition from 3100rpms to 4500rpms, way above the usual 'studder' point when cruising on the street....but there still is a noticeable 'rough spot' (audidble, but you can't feel it) using the #2 map.

 

The #3 map is the 'go to' map most of the time, as it is the most agressive, and has the most throttle response just above idle.

I just finished putting my bike back together after new piston and valves. New carb too, which was easier than a rebuild and new cables. Just wishing it wasn't so cold here and could get it out and get the jets dialed in.

 

Good luck with the bottom/top rebuild. I will be playing with the timing and see if I can finally get that stutter out without giving up any performance.






 
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