I'm ready to come home...


31 replies to this topic
  • Just_a_trail_rider

Posted September 18, 2013 - 03:20 PM

#1

Two  years ago, I drank  some koolaid.   Yes... it was orange, and it was good.  Very good if I must say so.  I liked it so much, I sold both my yamaha's  (wr450 and yz250).   When you riding those orange bikes and you are in the sweet spot.... OMG!     its great, really great.

 

But , my orange bike with the $3000 rebuilt KTM engine with 60 hrs took a shit...  again.  Needs about 2K worth of work to replace the intake valve, cams, followers, etc...   

 

So I say to myself....

 

 

NOT ONE MORE EFFIN NICKEL!  Not even a penny!     I won't even fix it up just to sell it.    

 

I bet the guy I sold my wr450 to would never sell it back to me.  He loves it.    So I'll be looking into the new wr450's.   I am concerned about the weight.  My 05 was a great bike, but was heavy and didn't turn or stop.   The KTM was light, turned well, and stopped on a friggin dime.   I need to see how much the new yamaha has closed the gap.

 

The scale weights are misleading I know.  So I gotta look up some real world reviews and opinions of people who ride them in the desert.

 

I've been away, but I'm ready to come home!



  • matt-h7

Posted September 18, 2013 - 03:31 PM

#2

Sounds like you need a 2 stroke. 90% cheaper top ends, 30% more power cc for cc, cheap easy to maintain/rebuild. Light.

  • JDLowrance

Posted September 18, 2013 - 04:45 PM

#3

Sounds like you need a 2 stroke. 90% cheaper top ends, 30% more power cc for cc, cheap easy to maintain/rebuild. Light.

 

Or a reliable four stroke....

 

The new (2012+) Wr's are still 15lbs heavier than the orange bikes but they feell much lighter than that. The only time you notice the weight is when you lift it up on to a bike stand.

 

The motor is way stonger than the older WRs due to the fuel injection...it snaps to attention whenever you need it.

 

The suspension is fantastic...way better than the orange stuff (all you need is springs for your weight). It can carve up the tight trails as well as scream across the desert with the best of them.

 

The front brake needs a little work. I solved the problem by installing a Braking OS rotor and pads and it now stops as well as my 525 did which is saying something (one finger most of the time). The clutch is a little stiff but you don't notice it after a ride or two unless you are switching back and forth between something with a hydraulic clutch. A couple guys on this forum are experimenting with the Magura clutch right now so this should solve the issue if needed.

 

And, to top it off (the reason you are back), the bike is stone reliable. It will provide you with hours and hours of drama-less performance. Stay on top of oil and filter changes, keep the airfilter clean and this bike will not let you down.

 

You can find great deals on these bikes which will leave a shit load of cash in your pocket to perform the necessary upgrades to get the most out of it and still have change left over vs just the cost of admission for an orange bike.

 

I sampled the coolaid a while back as well and while it was a good bike it was expensive to own and operate, the blue bikes are just better value for money...end of story.



  • matt-h7

Posted September 18, 2013 - 04:55 PM

#4

A reliable 4 stroke will be good now, but in the long run a 2 stroke will save you thosands

  • Just_a_trail_rider

Posted September 18, 2013 - 06:33 PM

#5

Sounds like you need a 2 stroke. 90% cheaper top ends, 30% more power cc for cc, cheap easy to maintain/rebuild. Light.

I've had both 2 strokes and four strokes.     I get what you are saying.  But... if you compare a reliable 2 stroke to a reliable 4 stroke then its almost a wash.  For years I had a wr450 and a yz250... both 2005's.  



  • Krannie McKranface

Posted September 18, 2013 - 06:38 PM

#6

A reliable 4 stroke will be good now, but in the long run a 2 stroke will save you thosands

Hogwash.



  • matt-h7

Posted September 18, 2013 - 06:39 PM

#7

Hogwash.

yeah talk to me later when that thummper blows up.

  • Just_a_trail_rider

Posted September 18, 2013 - 06:41 PM

#8

Or a reliable four stroke....

 

The new (2012+) Wr's are still 15lbs heavier than the orange bikes but they feell much lighter than that. The only time you notice the weight is when you lift it up on to a bike stand.

 

The motor is way stonger than the older WRs due to the fuel injection...it snaps to attention whenever you need it.

 

The suspension is fantastic...way better than the orange stuff (all you need is springs for your weight). It can carve up the tight trails as well as scream across the desert with the best of them.

 

The front brake needs a little work. I solved the problem by installing a Braking OS rotor and pads and it now stops as well as my 525 did which is saying something (one finger most of the time). The clutch is a little stiff but you don't notice it after a ride or two unless you are switching back and forth between something with a hydraulic clutch. A couple guys on this forum are experimenting with the Magura clutch right now so this should solve the issue if needed.

 

And, to top it off (the reason you are back), the bike is stone reliable. It will provide you with hours and hours of drama-less performance. Stay on top of oil and filter changes, keep the airfilter clean and this bike will not let you down.

 

You can find great deals on these bikes which will leave a shit load of cash in your pocket to perform the necessary upgrades to get the most out of it and still have change left over vs just the cost of admission for an orange bike.

 

I sampled the coolaid a while back as well and while it was a good bike it was expensive to own and operate, the blue bikes are just better value for money...end of story.

I know all about the reliability of the wr450.  I had an 05 than I rode hard and long and it was as reliable as an anvil.      But...   it had shortcomings.    

 

You don't realize how terribly, terribly bad Yamaha brakes are until you switch to a KTM.   If you got it to stop with one finger, that's amazing.   The clutch thing...   yes, that's an issue too.   You are right about the suspension.  I did have my KTM dialed in pretty well, but it cost a grand to get it there...    Something usable out of the box with some fatboy springs would be nice.

 

I don't think that the weight is all that much different.   

 

Anyway... I am going to calm down and try to make a good decision.   



  • JDLowrance

Posted September 18, 2013 - 07:47 PM

#9

I know all about the reliability of the wr450.  I had an 05 than I rode hard and long and it was as reliable as an anvil.      But...   it had shortcomings.    

 

That's why I mentioned 'the reason you are back'

 

You don't realize how terribly, terribly bad Yamaha brakes are until you switch to a KTM.   If you got it to stop with one finger, that's amazing.  

 

One finger with the oversized Braking rotor and pads...got it from Motorcycle Superstore for $230. Best money I've spent on the bike.

 

The clutch thing...   yes, that's an issue too.   You are right about the suspension.  I did have my KTM dialed in pretty well, but it cost a grand to get it there...    Something usable out of the box with some fatboy springs would be nice.

 

I don't think that the weight is all that much different.   

 

Anyway... I am going to calm down and try to make a good decision.   



  • cwallershasta

Posted September 19, 2013 - 07:00 AM

#10

Welcome back.  I think people are to caught up in how the older WR's were and just automatically think the 12 or newer is the same. At least this is what I find talking to people I see on the trails.  I don't know, I rode YZ's all this time until Yamaha gave me a reason to buy a WR and they certainly did just that.  When I start telling these previous WR owners what this bike is, they just look at me like they had no idea how different it is. As far as four stroke motors, I had a 426 that lasted five years before I rebuit the top end. I had an 08 YZ that lasted over five years before rebuild. Both of these motors had a lot of time on them and funny thing is that it didn't cost me thousands to fix. That being said I won't ever buy a 250 four stroke again, as I got a lot less time out it before rebuild. As neurotic as I am on maintenance on this WR I'm thinking I will probably get more than five years out of it before rebuild time. Also I saw in another thread that that WR is not good in the desert, bull crap, this is where this bike shines and it is incredible in the desert, especially in the sand. I know this because I live next to one. It's also good on the mountain single track as well. I've said it many times and I'll say it again I love this freakin bike.


Edited by cwallershasta, September 19, 2013 - 07:01 AM.


Visit the ThumperTalk Store for the lowest prices on motorcycle / ATV parts and accessories - Guaranteed
  • Krannie McKranface

Posted September 19, 2013 - 07:13 AM

#11

yeah talk to me later when that thummper blows up.

You are 16 years old.....and on your first bike...

I've had 28  4 strokes, raced 6 of them, and never had an engine failure of any kind.



  • 080

Posted September 19, 2013 - 07:31 AM

#12

The scale weights are misleading I know.  So I gotta look up some real world reviews and opinions of people who ride them in the desert.


What KTM are you comparing it to and what level of rider are you?

  • woods-rider

Posted September 19, 2013 - 07:36 AM

#13

You are 16 years old.....and on your first bike...

I've had 28  4 strokes, raced 6 of them, and never had an engine failure of any kind.

 

 

I am on the same page as you Krannie. Not quite as many bikes though.

 

I have had 6 thumpers and never a single engine problem EVER. My 2006 WR I had for almost 8 years and put about 1000 hours on it. I have never done a top or bottom end rebuild either.



  • 080

Posted September 19, 2013 - 07:40 AM

#14

A reliable 4 stroke will be good now, but in the long run a 2 stroke will save you thosands


Same guys that are blowing up their 4strks are the same guys blowing up their 2strks and for the same reason (lack of maintenance). The other "small" percent are actually doing the required maintenance and just the lemon etc from the manufacturer and again could be a 2 or 4strk.

  • Just_a_trail_rider

Posted September 19, 2013 - 07:54 AM

#15

What KTM are you comparing it to and what level of rider are you?

I'm an intermediate level rider that often rides at a race pace.   Although I am a hard judge of my own skills, I truthfully can handle a bike.    I don't care all that much for high speed 5th gear pinned type of riding, but prefer 3rd gear with never ending twist, turns, up's down and also like just a little of that technical stuff that tends to fog up your goggles.  

 

I have a 450xcf right now, dry weight is 238lbs.  Its a track bike setup for offroad.    It is night and day lighter than my 05 wr450 was.    

 

The new WR is listed at about 272lbs full of fuel.  The new KTM 450xcw is aboiut 252 with no fuel.    Take out the gas and I'd estimate that the new KTM is 10lbs lighter on the scale.   

 

But again, scale weight doesn't tell the whole story.



  • GP1K

Posted September 19, 2013 - 08:09 AM

#16

Or a reliable four stroke....

 

The new (2012+) Wr's are still 15lbs heavier than the orange bikes but they feell much lighter than that. The only time you notice the weight is when you lift it up on to a bike stand.

 

 

+1

 

FWIW, one of my buddies has a 2012 500 EXC, which on paper is lighter than my WR. But he himself says my bike feels lighter than his when riding. That said, if you jump on say a WR250, it definitely feels lighter, you won't be confusing the two. But it's kinda hard to describe, you can feel the weight of the 450 in terms of momentum, but the handling is still quick and precise, you never feel like you have to muscle the bike around, it just goes where you point it.



  • 080

Posted September 19, 2013 - 10:26 AM

#17

I'm an intermediate level rider that often rides at a race pace.   Although I am a hard judge of my own skills, I truthfully can handle a bike.    I don't care all that much for high speed 5th gear pinned type of riding, but prefer 3rd gear with never ending twist, turns, up's down and also like just a little of that technical stuff that tends to fog up your goggles.  

 

I have a 450xcf right now, dry weight is 238lbs.  Its a track bike setup for offroad.    It is night and day lighter than my 05 wr450 was.    

 

The new WR is listed at about 272lbs full of fuel.  The new KTM 450xcw is aboiut 252 with no fuel.    Take out the gas and I'd estimate that the new KTM is 10lbs lighter on the scale.   

 

But again, scale weight doesn't tell the whole story.

 

The Wr will weigh about 12lbs more than the XCW mentioned above but unless your constantly picking the bike up off the ground the 12bls is not even noticeable for general riding etc. I'm use to riding modified track bikes for desert so here is my perspective when comparing. I would say the stock suspension is that of an XCW as far as plushness etc and does great in the slower tech stuff or for the beginner to intermediate on race day. For the intermediate on up "at a race pace" the usual valving/springs will need to be considered as both are on the soft side, riding a little low in the stroke which causes the undesired effects when pushed to hard. That said I have not done either on my bike and have pretty much got the stock set up as best I can. All though I can still keep the pace with the guys I ride with I do back off in certain area's that I would not normally if my suspension was set up for a little more aggressive riding. I notice the weight difference (vs track bike) for the most part in down hill sections. The front tends to dive to easily causing a heavier feel to it but "again" a suspension rework would fix a lot of it. Overall this is a good bike and for singletrack handles very well. As stated in other post, If I was still racing hare scrambles etc I would pick this bike over my last Yz450 just because it seems to turn better and feel more nimble in the technical stuff.



  • ubu

Posted September 19, 2013 - 04:22 PM

#18

My 08 450 xcf is pretty darn reliable.

 
Straight stalker case :devil:
 
I was gonna ask what year your KTM is, but decided to search the KTM forum instead. 
 
I kinda chuckled when I found this :p
 
Anyway, don't mind me. I'm just lurking around trying to decide on a new bike. Had a 08 YZ450 and decided to go 2-stroke with an 05 KTM. Yeah it's light, but the suspension is nowhere near my Yamaha. I had my 4 bikes I was thinking of: a new 300xc with linkage, YZ250, 450XC-F, and the latest to cross my mind is the WR450.
 
Guess I can cross one of those off the list. Sorry your bike took a dump.

Edited by ubu, September 19, 2013 - 04:24 PM.


  • Just_a_trail_rider

Posted September 19, 2013 - 08:33 PM

#19

 
Straight stalker case :devil:
 
I was gonna ask what year your KTM is, but decided to search the KTM forum instead. 
 
I kinda chuckled when I found this :p
 
Anyway, don't mind me. I'm just lurking around trying to decide on a new bike. Had a 08 YZ450 and decided to go 2-stroke with an 05 KTM. Yeah it's light, but the suspension is nowhere near my Yamaha. I had my 4 bikes I was thinking of: a new 300xc with linkage, YZ250, 450XC-F, and the latest to cross my mind is the WR450.
 
Guess I can cross one of those off the list. Sorry your bike took a dump.

Yes... I said that.   But I was under the influence of the Kool Aid!     ;)

 

The suspension on my KTM was dialed in.  It cost some bucks, but it was every bit as good at the suspension on my yamahas.   But out of the box, the KYB stuff is better.  

 

Btw...  the 08 KTM motors are the bad ones.    They eventually fixed the problems with it in 2010.  I had upgraded to all of the 2010 spec parts but that still wasn't enough.

 

The current 450xc-f is a completely redesigned motor.   I have heard nothing but good things about it.   Don't compare it to the 08.



  • MidlifeCrisisGuy

Posted September 20, 2013 - 06:23 AM

#20

The WR engine, uncorked, is simply incredible. The rider has a choice of power output from about 20 HP fully corked to 50+ HP with a muffler, the GYTR tuner and an inexpensive cam swap or degreeing. That versatility makes it easy to tune for just about any riding situation.

I think the WR450F is overweight in stock form. Fortunately its pretty easy to remove 20+ pounds from the bike, mostly placed high on the bike, and it feels like a totally different bike when you do.

FYI, a stock 2014 YZ450F weighs 245 lbs with fuel and no off road equipment. Thats 235 pounds dry. I've got my 2012 WR450F down to 240 pounds dry with some off road equipment.

Edited by MidlifeCrisisGuy, September 20, 2013 - 06:25 AM.





 
x

Join Our Community!

Even if you don't want to post, registered members get access to tools that make finding & following the good stuff easier.

If you enjoyed reading about "" here in the ThumperTalk archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join ThumperTalk today!

The views and opinions expressed on this page are strictly those of the author, and have not been reviewed or approved by ThumperTalk.