My WR450 25 pound trim off...

Yamaha WR450F

434 replies to this topic
  • Monk

Posted July 29, 2014 - 01:43 PM


If your in So. Cal your invited !


Slowly making my way south....

  • MidlifeCrisisGuy

Posted July 29, 2014 - 02:02 PM


It's not a detuned YZF motor. It's the same old WR motor but now with FI. The YZF motor is backwards, the WR is not. Not same at all.
  Check out the pre 2010 YZ450Fs.  That is where the current WR engine came from, and all the ones before it too. 

 

How much power do you want your mount to have ?  50 HP is easy from a current WR with YZ cams, exhaust and the right tune.  With a great power band.  And its totally bulletproof too.



  • GP1K

Posted July 29, 2014 - 02:15 PM


  Check out the pre 2010 YZ450Fs.  That is where the current WR engine came from, and all the ones before it too. 

 

How much power do you want your mount to have ?  50 HP is easy from a current WR with YZ cams, exhaust and the right tune.  With a great power band.  And its totally bulletproof too.

 

 

Yes pretty much everything on the WR has trickled down from YZFs at some point. But the current WR motor is not the current YZF backwards-facing hotness, that was my point.

 

Not that much. That's why I got a 250 XCF-W. :thumbsup:

 

I'm really interested to see if they come out with a YZF-based WR250 next year similar to the 450, but complete with backwards motor. I just couldn't hold out that long, so I got the KTM instead.



  • bradgross71

Posted July 29, 2014 - 03:04 PM


I get a good laugh when I hear how heavy the wr is and how awesome the ktm is. Everything I have ever read says the ktm is 6 or 7 pounds lighter. Probably 3% of riders would benefit from that weight difference.

  • stevethe

Posted July 29, 2014 - 03:11 PM


Slowly making my way south....


Nice I will post a 500 Orange muffin doing the Tenesse shuffle going up it.

  • stevethe

Posted July 29, 2014 - 06:49 PM


The 500 orange thang doing the Tennessee shuffle up the dog trap.

 

http://i1275.photobu...zpsa9fa18de.mp4



  • Krannie McKranface

Posted August 14, 2014 - 04:05 PM


What did you do with the (3) vent hoses from the engine (with the T connector)?

 

Did you remove the starter hose?

No other bike I know has one.

I would thing the valve cover breather,re-routed to under the skid plate, would  be all you would need......but I don't know if the starter vent is part of the balanced pressure or not...



  • MidlifeCrisisGuy

Posted August 14, 2014 - 05:33 PM


What did you do with the (3) vent hoses from the engine (with the T connector)?

 

Did you remove the starter hose?

No other bike I know has one.

I would thing the valve cover breather,re-routed to under the skid plate, would  be all you would need......but I don't know if the starter vent is part of the balanced pressure or not...

 

I removed the starter hose entirely and plugged off the port with a vacuum cap.   I think you can see it in one of the pictures.  I removed the Tee and replaced it with a hose barb.

 

I suspect the purpose of the starter vent was to vent gasses and oil that made its way up into the starter gear housing.   I suspect that the clearances were such that under certain conditions oil sort of sealed off the cavity and allowed a pressure build up.   I checked that there was no pressure build up in the crank case when the starter gears were removed and there was none.

 

By connecting connecting the two remaining hoses with the hose barb, the valve cover breathes into the air box.   On 4 stroke YZs the valve cover breathes through a hose attached to the front down tube.   If you google there have been instances where YZs sucked water up the breather tube into the engine, thus I kept mine venting into the air box.  Although the air box could act as a water trap and force the engine to vent through the retained water.    I'm not sure what one should do to improve the valve cover breathing.



  • Krannie McKranface

Posted August 14, 2014 - 05:49 PM


Very good

Thanks



  • MidlifeCrisisGuy

Posted August 25, 2014 - 07:35 AM


Here is an updated summary for the weight loss to date.

 

Removals

Done: Starter: 1.63 lbs
Done: Starter idler gears: 1.05 lbs
Done: Tank mount bracket: 0.39 pounds with the 4 bolts
Done: Starter switch and harness to right side rad mount 0.11 lbs
Done: Boil off vent hose, tank to under bike, 0.15 lbs
Done: Head light assembly 1.45 pounds
Done: Reflectors: 0.72 pounds
Done: Trip computer assembly: 0.88 pounds
Done: Battery: 4.60 pounds
Done: Snorkel: 0.52 pounds, with screws
Done: Starter relay, cables, isolator rubber, other relays, etc.  0.88 pounds.
Done: Boil off bottle and connector hose: 0.52 pounds
Done: Battery tray, boil off bottle fender plastic, ECM rubber isolator: 0.44 pounds
Done: Breather reduction off starter port.  0.13 pounds gross, about 0.12 pounds net
Done: Throttle body harness holder.  0.06 pounds
Done: Front brake line bracket  0.13 pounds
Done: Skid plate rubber block    0.11 pounds
Done: Aluminum rear sprocket 1 pound net.   stock 1.78 pounds - new 0.78 pounds
Done: Starter clutch and gear. 1.45 pounds, lighter flywheel and less gyroscopic mass as well.
Done: Handlebar ends trimmed off.  0.06 pounds
Done: kickstand 1.16 pounds
Done: muffler 7.45 stock - 5.28 FMF + differences in SAs = 2.20
Done: rear tail light: 0.40 pounds
Done: lean angle sensor bracket: 0.37 pounds
Done: Magura clutch: 0.20 pounds (0.97 for stock - 0.77 Magura)
Done: Remove cluch cable guide and capacitor bracket 0.11 pounds
Done: Removed the WR kickstand peg mount.  1.05 pounds - 0.39 = 0.66 pound loss.
Done: Remove the number plate mounts I built
Done: Removed speedo drive 0.55 pounds, 0.30 pounds net

 

Total weight loss 21.67 pounds.  

 

Stock no fuel weight: 260lbs - 21.67 loss = 238.33 pounds, no fuel , before additions

Additions
Hand guards were 0.48 x 2 + .24 lbs for mounts = 1.2 pounds

Present no fuel weight: 239.50 lbs.



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  • openbook215

Posted August 25, 2014 - 08:10 AM


Have you done anything with the coil and boat anchor coil bracket ?  I wrapped my radiator around the coil twice and decided to move it to a more sensible location, I modified the bracket to work in the new location but an aluminum bracket could be made relatively easy I think.

image.jpg
image (3).jpg


  • RockerYZWR

Posted August 25, 2014 - 08:14 AM


Thanks for posting all this. I'm really considering doing a lightening project on my bike, but with the Cycras, Mohard rad guards, Scotts stabilizer, Flexx bars, and a couple other doodads, I feel like I'd basically just get back down to stock WR weight and lose conveniences like a starter and kickstand...

  • MidlifeCrisisGuy

Posted August 25, 2014 - 08:17 AM


I haven't moved mine yet.  I agree its in a terrible location.  I was ready to but couldn't get it done in time for a ride.  Its on my list of things to do.

 

You did a really nice job of yours except I wonder how susceptible it is to crash damage ?

 

The reason the mount is steel (and heavy) is because the mount itself completes the magnetic circuit.   You can't replace the entire thing with aluminum.  I suspect a small strip of steel, maybe 1/2" x 3/16" would suffice for completing the magnetic circuit, but I haven't tested that.  FWIW, transformer steel would be best, followed by plain steel, followed by stainless steel being worst.  Some SS won't work at all.

 

You can make the mount itself aluminum, but you need to keep a piece of steel in the magnetic circuit so the flux has a path.

 

Has anyone looked at how (the same) coil is mounted on the YZ450F and the 2014 YZ250F ?


Edited by MidlifeCrisisGuy, August 25, 2014 - 08:18 AM.


  • AKmotoXrider907

Posted August 25, 2014 - 10:34 PM


I'm not trying to piss in your cheerios but riding dirt bikes is 95% rider.

A lighter bike won't make up for an out of shape rider.


Actually the rider weight has little to do with maneuverability of the bike. It's about when you throw the bike around how much it weighs, your weight comes into play but barely. Unless your trying for top speed. But them again I'm 150lbs riding a 450 so I'm just going off what I've experienced.

  • openbook215

Posted August 26, 2014 - 05:16 AM


I haven't moved mine yet.  I agree its in a terrible location.  I was ready to but couldn't get it done in time for a ride.  Its on my list of things to do.

 

You did a really nice job of yours except I wonder how susceptible it is to crash damage ?

 

The reason the mount is steel (and heavy) is because the mount itself completes the magnetic circuit.   You can't replace the entire thing with aluminum.  I suspect a small strip of steel, maybe 1/2" x 3/16" would suffice for completing the magnetic circuit, but I haven't tested that.  FWIW, transformer steel would be best, followed by plain steel, followed by stainless steel being worst.  Some SS won't work at all.

 

You can make the mount itself aluminum, but you need to keep a piece of steel in the magnetic circuit so the flux has a path.

 

Has anyone looked at how (the same) coil is mounted on the YZ450F and the 2014 YZ250F ?

What you can't see from my pics is the coil bracket rolls inward to clear the kickstarter.  So far no damage, you can see the frame peppered just above the coil so I guess it could be a DNF if it were hit just right.  I test out its worthiness on a regular basis.  Most bikes i've seen or owned in the past had the coil protected up under the tank somewhere, but thats not gonna happen here.  My thought was $90 for a new coil or $320 for a new radiator (no I won't buy chinese...mmm chinese).  I'm not sure that the bracket material matters as long as theres a path to ground on the bar of the coil.  Now if I could just protect the exhaust header adequately....


Edited by openbook215, August 26, 2014 - 05:26 AM.


  • KennyMc

Posted August 26, 2014 - 06:10 AM


I hadn't read it but were you able to weigh your bike at one time on a scale? I know your weighing the parts, just didn't know if you ever actually weighed the bike in total.

  • MidlifeCrisisGuy

Posted August 26, 2014 - 07:44 AM


Thanks for posting all this. I'm really considering doing a lightening project on my bike, but with the Cycras, Mohard rad guards, Scotts stabilizer, Flexx bars, and a couple other doodads, I feel like I'd basically just get back down to stock WR weight and lose conveniences like a starter and kickstand...

 

People always say things like this and I don't get it.  If you don't lighten your WR and you add those things, you'll have a 280+ pound bike, full of fuel.  In my mind there is some sort of exponential curve of bike weight versus my want to ride it.

 

200 pounds - Anorexic, not interested.

210 pounds - OK.

220 pounds - Nice bike.

230 pounds - Sweet.

240 pounds - Perfection.

250 pounds - Athletic.

260 pounds - Muscular.

270 pounds - Beefy

280 pounds - Out of shape.

290 pounds - Borderline obese

300 pounds - No thanks.

 

Losing 20 pounds on a 280 pound bike is the difference between the bike being Out of shape and Muscular.

 

My bike was in pieces this past weekend, waiting for a part.  I did a ride on borrowed bikes, one being a 200ish pound bored and stroked YZ125 and the other being a 230 pound bored and stroked YZ250F.   The differences were very interesting. 

 

The YZ125 bounced around a lot.  Very flickable, fast in tight stuff, but it lost so much ground when the going got tough, both for me and another rider.  I could not make it up one hill at all, in spite of that I cruise up the same hill in 3rd on my WR450F.  Apparently the secret was to downshift 2 gears as soon as it came off the pipe in 3rd.   The bike's owner got it up the hill, but it took way more effort than the YZ250F did.  The YZ125 bike needs constant correction when you ride it.  They are easy corrections, but lots of them.

 

The YZ250F was way more planted all the time.  Hill climbs were way easier than the 125, but still harder than I remember them being on my WR450F.  Its got mellower power off the bottom, which is nice but its also got less torque which means it doesn't hold gears as long on hills.   Its not as flickable, but it requires less input.  It takes more effort to put it on a line, but it stays on the line better and takes more to get it off.

 

I want to do a ride where we swap back and forth between the YZ250F and my WR450F.  Stay tuned.

 

 

Actually the rider weight has little to do with maneuverability of the bike. It's about when you throw the bike around how much it weighs, your weight comes into play but barely. Unless your trying for top speed. But them again I'm 150lbs riding a 450 so I'm just going off what I've experienced.

 

Kudos to you for riding a big bike given your weight.  You illustrate a good lesson for all of us.   If you can handle the 450s, surely us 200+ pound "men" can as well.

 

I'm beginning to realize that when I pilot my WR correctly and its carrying me, it isn't heavy.  The faster and more aggressive I ride it, the lighter it feels, even in tight technical terrain.   Its when I am goign slow, using poor technique and having to manhandle it through stuff that its heavy.   A big bike penalizes you more in those circumstances but rewards you more when its ridden correctly.   There is a reason that Scott Summers won races on an XR600 against featherweight 2 strokes. 


Edited by MidlifeCrisisGuy, August 26, 2014 - 07:47 AM.


  • MidlifeCrisisGuy

Posted August 26, 2014 - 07:55 AM


I hadn't read it but were you able to weigh your bike at one time on a scale? I know your weighing the parts, just didn't know if you ever actually weighed the bike in total.

 

I have not.  I don't have a decent scale to do so either. 

 

The published curb weight of 273 pounds has been verified by several owners, so I am pretty confident in it.  

 

However, the July 2103 Dirt Bike article comparing the 2003 to the 2013 lists the 2013's weight at 257 pounds (versus 262 without fuel for the 2003).  I think 257 pounds is either a typo, a mix up between the bikes, they had the battery removed when they weighed it or they used Yamaha's famous "dry weight", ie no fuel, oil or coolant. 



  • Jonesy11

Posted August 26, 2014 - 08:01 AM


People always say things like this and I don't get it. If you don't lighten your WR and you add those things, you'll have a 280+ pound bike, full of fuel. In my mind there is some sort of exponential curve of bike weight versus my want to ride it.

200 pounds - Anorexic, not interested.
210 pounds - OK.
220 pounds - Nice bike.
230 pounds - Sweet.
240 pounds - Perfection.
250 pounds - Athletic.
260 pounds - Muscular.
270 pounds - Beefy
280 pounds - Out of shape.
290 pounds - Borderline obese
300 pounds - No thanks.

Losing 20 pounds on a 280 pound bike is the difference between the bike being Out of shape and Muscular.

My bike was in pieces this past weekend, waiting for a part. I did a ride on borrowed bikes, one being a 200ish pound bored and stroked YZ125 and the other being a 230 pound bored and stroked YZ250F. The differences were very interesting.

The YZ125 bounced around a lot. Very flickable, fast in tight stuff, but it lost so much ground when the going got tough, both for me and another rider. I could not make it up one hill at all, in spite of that I cruise up the same hill in 3rd on my WR450F. Apparently the secret was to downshift 2 gears as soon as it came off the pipe in 3rd. The bike's owner got it up the hill, but it took way more effort than the YZ250F did. The YZ125 bike needs constant correction when you ride it. They are easy corrections, but lots of them.

The YZ250F was way more planted all the time. Hill climbs were way easier than the 125, but still harder than I remember them being on my WR450F. Its got mellower power off the bottom, which is nice but its also got less torque which means it doesn't hold gears as long on hills. Its not as flickable, but it requires less input. It takes more effort to put it on a line, but it stays on the line better and takes more to get it off.

I want to do a ride where we swap back and forth between the YZ250F and my WR450F. Stay tuned.



Kudos to you for riding a big bike given your weight. You illustrate a good lesson for all of us. If you can handle the 450s, surely us 200+ pound "men" can as well.

I'm beginning to realize that when I pilot my WR correctly and its carrying me, it isn't heavy. The faster and more aggressive I ride it, the lighter it feels, even in tight technical terrain. Its when I am goign slow, using poor technique and having to manhandle it through stuff that its heavy. A big bike penalizes you more in those circumstances but rewards you more when its ridden correctly. There is a reason that Scott Summers won races on an XR600 against featherweight 2 strokes.


100% agree.

  • KennyMc

Posted August 26, 2014 - 09:49 AM


100% agree.

Yeah, but you ride with Lightning, you don't matter :lol:





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