Ability to lug....


50 replies to this topic
  • bobpara

Posted May 13, 2013 - 07:06 AM

#1

I am switching over from a Suzuki DR350 to an '06 WR450

When the going gets tough, that DR is unbelievable....like a billy goat. I think its virtue is that you can lug that engine down to like 100 rpm in a tight section almost like a trials bike. You can almost count each firing of the cylinder !!

The new WR is nice, but once you drop below a certain rpm (I don't have a tach), it can rather abruptly stall. I can slip the clutch and do other things, but when the going gets tight, it is just one more thing you have to be aware of = harder to ride.

Is there an easy (cheap) way to fix this problem aside from maybe a heavier flywheel?

  • JDLowrance

Posted May 13, 2013 - 07:15 AM

#2

Rekluse clutch.

Not cheap but sounds like the best fix for your type of riding.

Edited by JDLowrance, May 13, 2013 - 07:16 AM.


  • bobpara

Posted May 13, 2013 - 07:44 AM

#3

I have seen numerous postings on this brand of clutch.....how does a clutch create the ability for the engine to lug?.....is it just easier to slip?

  • bikedude987

Posted May 13, 2013 - 08:28 AM

#4

It isn't just a brand of clutch, Rekluse sells automatic clutches aka. no stalling. (though they do sell a manual clutch as well...) You still have the ability to disengage their clutch with the lever, but when rpm's drop too low it will begin to slip itself until it disengaged completely near idle. Very nice for rocks and slow speed, but I would suggest just getting good at modulating your clutch (having ridded a wr with a rekluse, and have gone back to a manual).

  • Krannie McKranface

Posted May 13, 2013 - 09:48 AM

#5

No, the WR will never tractor like your DR350, period.

The DR motor is ANCIENT in design, and has a substantially larger amount of reciprocating mass inside the motor, creating massive off-idle torque.

Learn to use the clutch, gear down, or get a Rekluse EXP.

  • n16ht5

Posted May 13, 2013 - 11:32 AM

#6

What Krannie said. I have a Z - Start pro though, which does the job. I cam off honda XR's

  • William1

Posted May 13, 2013 - 12:15 PM

#7

A WR is a woods race bike, it is not a trail plonker. A modern trail plonker is a DRZ400. There is no 'fix' other than riding it like it was designed to be ridden or to get another bike.

People stall Ferraris in traffic. It is not whgere they belong.

  • revyrider

Posted May 13, 2013 - 02:27 PM

#8

Just put in the Rekluse EXP 2.0 in my '07 ($400) & it works great in tight & sliperey situations with no stalling. Highly recommended!

  • bobpara

Posted May 14, 2013 - 08:05 AM

#9

Thanks for the input guys!
Sounds like there is a definite consensus:

1) Deal with it
2) Get a recluse for about $500, and it seems like some of you went back after installing it

I disagree with the DRZ-400. It may have more modern forks but its a pig and its too heavy to be a good woods bike. If that thing gets stuck in a mud hole you'd better be awfully big and strong to get it out !!
The new WR 450 tips the scale 10-20 pounds less than my DR350....I'd never go any heavier than that.

  • bobpara

Posted May 14, 2013 - 08:10 AM

#10

One other thing: I heard Krannie mention a lot of heavy mass inside the motor on the DR
That can actually be a good thing for tractability in tight places.
Back in the days of two strokes that was THE way to tame the power band on a two stroke.
I this months edition of Dirt Rider they had an article of fixing up a WR450 and they basically had the same issue I had with it.
They found the thing to be too 'abrupt'
They put a heavier flywheel and cam in it.
I'd be content with just some more mass in the motor.....anyone have any idea IF or WHERE I could get a heavier flywheel?

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  • Krannie McKranface

Posted May 14, 2013 - 08:17 AM

#11

One other thing: I heard Krannie mention a lot of heavy mass inside the motor on the DR
That can actually be a good thing for tractability in tight places.
Back in the days of two strokes that was THE way to tame the power band on a two stroke.
I this months edition of Dirt Rider they had an article of fixing up a WR450 and they basically had the same issue I had with it.
They found the thing to be too 'abrupt'
They put a heavier flywheel and cam in it.
I'd be content with just some more mass in the motor.....anyone have any idea IF or WHERE I could get a heavier flywheel?


If you use the TECHNICIAN tuner (not the GYT tuner) you can alter timing and FI below the 4k point, and solve the off-idle abruptnees associated with most FI maps.
Unfortunately, it's expensive.
Your dealer can do it, but you have to 'sign an off-road only disclaimer' form. That's if you dealer wants to do it.
In Australia, it's a common practice.

  • woods-rider

Posted May 14, 2013 - 08:33 AM

#12

If you use the TECHNICIAN tuner (not the GYT tuner) you can alter timing and FI below the 4k point, and solve the off-idle abruptnees associated with most FI maps.
Unfortunately, it's expensive.
Your dealer can do it, but you have to 'sign an off-road only disclaimer' form. That's if you dealer wants to do it.
In Australia, it's a common practice.


He has a 2006, no FI to modify.

  • Krannie McKranface

Posted May 14, 2013 - 09:43 AM

#13

He has a 2006, no FI to modify.

I knew that.

Just seeing if I was paying attention.

I was. Just not to this.

If it's too abrupt, you can add a G2 throttle cam to slow down the throttle action.

Works great.

  • spomey

Posted May 14, 2013 - 07:26 PM

#14

No, the WR will never tractor like your DR350, period.

The DR motor is ANCIENT in design, and has a substantially larger amount of reciprocating mass inside the motor, creating massive off-idle torque.

Learn to use the clutch, gear down, or get a Rekluse EXP.


i disagree - i regeared my 07 WR 450 using 12 up front and 52 in the back, i can still run 80 mph which is fast enough for me on dirt roads and it lugs like crazy. I weigh 260 lbs and ride at 8000+ ft if there is any issue at all, increase the idle a bit..no problems lugging at all.

  • Krannie McKranface

Posted May 14, 2013 - 07:45 PM

#15

i disagree - i regeared my 07 WR 450 using 12 up front and 52 in the back, i can still run 80 mph which is fast enough for me on dirt roads and it lugs like crazy. I weigh 260 lbs and ride at 8000+ ft if there is any issue at all, increase the idle a bit..no problems lugging at all.


Yeah, that's not possible.

...and gearing down makes it lug LESS, not more.

  • bobpara

Posted May 15, 2013 - 07:29 AM

#16

Funny you should mention that, I ordered a 15T front sprocket (stock is 14 T)
From what I have seen is when you gear it taller, it becomes better at lugging I think.....

  • KennyMc

Posted May 15, 2013 - 10:06 AM

#17

Think of a 10 speed bicycle and how the front and rear chain ring affects the bike.

Transitioning from the smaller front chain ring to the next bigger one will make it go faster with the same amount of force. In motorcycle speak, this will make it harder to do the slower techincial stuff without stalling or using more clutch.

In the back, going from the smaller chain ring to the bigger chain ring will make it go slower and in motorcycle speak will make it easier to do the slower technical stuff without stalling or using more clutch.

This of course is assuming a flat surface for said bicycle.

Unless of course I have my head up my :moon: :lol:

  • YamaFling

Posted May 15, 2013 - 10:20 AM

#18

I noticed more "lugg-ability" when I put in a bigger piston to up the bike to 472cc. My guess as to why was a combination of reasons listed above. Bigger piston = more mass, and the bigger displacement gives more power to spin that flywheel up at the lower RPMs.

  • SLC18T

Posted May 15, 2013 - 11:20 AM

#19

Little wrong information in here. Please note.

Smaller in the front - same effect as - larger in the rear. Lower top speed. Better "luggability". Lower speed in 1st. 12 tooth will give you a little more bottom end.
Larger in the front - same effect as - smaller in the rear. Higher top speed. Higher speed in 1st. 15 tooth in the front will make it go well over 90 and not have as much on the bottom for the woods.

I have been around bikes all my life and learned from the best. I have changed the gearing on almost every bike I have had to make it more to my liking. I plan to try a 12 on the front and see if it gives me enough bottom end boost to make me a little happier in the tight stuff.

  • SLC18T

Posted May 15, 2013 - 11:27 AM

#20

Good site to determine what the changes in sprockets will do to your bike.

http://www.gearingcommander.com/




 
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